Tube Preamp

Audiolab 7000CDT CD Transport
arj said:
This is what I would suggest. Tube dacs dont mean much but a tube pre will definitely do well.
You will need to match it with your amp though..ie impedence match it where the preamp output impedance is 1/10 or lower than the amp input impedance
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Do you have any suggestions other than the Freya with AES/EBU input and XLR balanced output within budget?

drlowmu said:
Decadent :

Just borrow a tube preamp from a FM, or get a Hi Fi Retailer to allow you to try out a model, with a right of return .

Jeff
Click to expand...

Usually there are no returns here.

reignofchaos said:
@Decadent_Spectre : What is the rest of your chain? I understand it's pro audio but what is it?
Click to expand...

Rather not get into setup details. I will say my source is a PC. No CDP/Vinyl.

Edit - arj, I just checked and pro amps usually have very high input impedance, the ones I checked all had 10 k ohms or higher input impedance.
 
Decadent_Spectre said:
Do you have any suggestions other than the Freya with AES/EBU input and XLR balanced output within budget?



Usually there are no returns here.



Rather not get into setup details. I will say my source is a PC. No CDP/Vinyl.

Edit - arj, I just checked and pro amps usually have very high input impedance, the ones I checked all had 10 k ohms or higher input impedance.
Click to expand...

The XLR/AES is the one which complicates. If you are looking for a native balanced design then personally not aware of any other than BAT and Audio research. and both seem to be higher than your planned budget. Since you mentioned you use very high powered Pro amps and listen at high volumes, you will need a tube preamp with a very low noise floor.

The new Prima Luna does have it but not sure of the design itself is balanced but this should fall into your budget. Absolute Phase ie Prithvi is the dealer for this and his prices may seem higher but from what I understand he provides all the necessary warranty/repair as well.

Another option is Linear tube audio - Mz3 and they may able to customize an XLR for you. I personally use their MZ2 as a preamp..it does a very clean tube sound with hardly any microphonic and it has a killer headphone out.They ship direct and Nicholas is excellent with his customer responses/details.
 
arj said:
The XLR/AES is the one which complicates. If you are looking for a native balanced design then personally not aware of any other than BAT and Audio research. and both seem to be higher than your planned budget. Since you mentioned you use very high powered Pro amps and listen at high volumes, you will need a tube preamp with a very low noise floor.

The new Prima Luna does have it but not sure of the design itself is balanced but this should fall into your budget. Absolute Phase ie Prithvi is the dealer for this and his prices may seem higher but from what I understand he provides all the necessary warranty/repair as well.

Another option is Linear tube audio - Mz3 and they may able to customize an XLR for you. I personally use their MZ2 as a preamp..it does a very clean tube sound with hardly any microphonic and it has a killer headphone out.They ship direct and Nicholas is excellent with his customer responses/details.
Click to expand...

Hi arj, I will look into the others but the Linear tube audio states it has details and the clarity of solid state, I do not want this. Thanks for the suggestions.
 
Decadent_Spectre said:
Hi arj, I will look into the others but the Linear tube audio states it has details and the clarity of solid state, I do not want this. Thanks for the suggestions.
Click to expand...
yup thats right since I have a tube Amp I did not want the pre to be tubey...
 
arj said:
yup thats right since I have a tube Amp I did not want the pre to be tubey...
Click to expand...

I'm looking to be as tubey as possible :D

Just so that I know I have tried it out properly and know for sure whether it is my cup of tea or not.

The BAT and Audio Research are definitely out of budget. The PrimaLuna may be in budget if I extend, but not sure on this one. Will research.

Have you heard any of these? As before looking for tubey and warm sound, lack of detail/clarity welcome.
 
Decadent_Spectre said:
I'm looking to be as tubey as possible :D

Just so that I know I have tried it out properly and know for sure whether it is my cup of tea or not.

The BAT and Audio Research are definitely out of budget. The PrimaLuna may be in budget if I extend, but not sure on this one. Will research.

Have you heard any of these? As before looking for tubey and warm sound, lack of detail/clarity welcome.
Click to expand...
the problem with (ok let me continue to use the word ! ) "Tubey" could also mean some tube noise which might get amplified a lot in your setup

But Prima Luna is perhaps one of those which manage the tube advantages and keep the background noise low as well.

The main constraint here is the Balanced input and output. if you are open to single ended design with an XLR to RCA connector then you have so many more options like the lower end Prima Lunas, Jolida , and even the Lyrita DHT pre.

You also have the option of introducing a Tube buffer between your CDP and SS pre as well..although I am again not an advocate of complicating the chain.
 
arj said:
the problem with (ok let me continue to use the word ! ) "Tubey" could also mean some tube noise which might get amplified a lot in your setup

But Prima Luna is perhaps one of those which manage the tube advantages and keep the background noise low as well.

The main constraint here is the Balanced input and output. if you are open to single ended design with an XLR to RCA connector then you have so many more options like the lower end Prima Lunas, Jolida , and even the Lyrita DHT pre.

You also have the option of introducing a Tube buffer between your CDP and SS pre as well..although I am again not an advocate of complicating the chain.
Click to expand...

The primaluna is reputed to be to a little more on the neutral/detailed side from the reviews I read but there are satisfied owners.

Don't really want to get into RCA, if so I've read good things about Conrad Johnson.

What is the difference between a buffer and a preamp?

My chain is - PC>DSP (works as both DSP and DAC)>Amp>Speaker, currently not a very complicated chain. By adding a tube pre or DAC I am complicating the chain.

Have you heard of a company called Supratek? They look very interesting and in budget, I've sent them an email.
 
Decadent_Spectre said:
The primaluna is reputed to be to a little more on the neutral/detailed side from the reviews I read but there are satisfied owners.

Don't really want to get into RCA, if so I've read good things about Conrad Johnson.

What is the difference between a buffer and a preamp?
Click to expand...
Conrad Johnson is again legendary .They voice their components to sound warm as a "House sound" although not sure if they do have a preamp in your range. They do have an excellent integrated ..the CAV 45 but it has a passive pre so defeats your purpose.

Prithvi at Absolute phase is again the dealer and he does provide support to this brand as well as he has apparently invested in a support service

A tube buffer is usually put between a CDP and a preamp..it is usually unity gain and the purpose is more of an impedance matcher ie present a relatively benign load to the Source than the actual preamp load , Of course it only make true sense if the source output power can get troubled by a preamp !

Many folks, including yours truly, have used it as an inexpensive way to get a "Tube Sound" since it does a minor tube amplification but my personal view is its a waste unless you have no other option and I would prefer upgrading the source than complicating the chain...but again many have liked it as well.

My chain is - PC>DSP (works as both DSP and DAC)>Amp>Speaker, currently not a very complicated chain. By adding a tube pre or DAC I am complicating the chain.

Have you heard of a company called Supratek? They look very interesting and in budget, I've sent them an email.
Jolida Fusion is another pre with Balanced connections
Click to expand...
BTW Where is the Volume control In your chain, ? with the above chain you will perhaps be able to get a feel of what a tube has done only with the pre. with the dac the change you see may be more due to the DAC design rather than the tube and since the tube is just at the output stage, a Tube Buffer may not be too bad an option. Acoustic Portrait do make a tube buffer.

I had not heard of Supratek and its interesting, since they do made to order, and I see both the 6SN7 and DHT pre's. Considering that DHT have been praised by most true tube lovers the best option might be worthwhile to get Lyrita DHT and request Viren if he can give you a balanced input and output. I doubt if there will be too much of a difference. Considering your budget you can work with Viren for better transformers and volume pots.
 
This gentleman has some good builds..

Tube buffer made with high end components

This is Tube buffer I build with Brimar CV4003 12AU7. All the load line and safety factor considered while designing. Sound is very lush and warm with huge soundstage and instrument separation, Silky smooth. Please see attached video. Comments are welcome. I have Mundorf Supreme 4.7 uF capacitor...
www.hifivision.com www.hifivision.com
 
arj said:
Conrad Johnson is again legendary .They voice their components to sound warm as a "House sound" although not sure if they do have a preamp in your range. They do have an excellent integrated ..the CAV 45 but it has a passive pre so defeats your purpose.

Prithvi at Absolute phase is again the dealer and he does provide support to this brand as well as he has apparently invested in a support service

A tube buffer is usually put between a CDP and a preamp..it is usually unity gain and the purpose is more of an impedance matcher ie present a relatively benign load to the Source than the actual preamp load , Of course it only make true sense if the source output power can get troubled by a preamp !

Many folks, including yours truly, have used it as an inexpensive way to get a "Tube Sound" since it does a minor tube amplification but my personal view is its a waste unless you have no other option and I would prefer upgrading the source than complicating the chain...but again many have liked it as well.


BTW Where is the Volume control In your chain, ? with the above chain you will perhaps be able to get a feel of what a tube has done only with the pre. with the dac the change you see may be more due to the DAC design rather than the tube and since the tube is just at the output stage, a Tube Buffer may not be too bad an option. Acoustic Portrait do make a tube buffer.

I had not heard of Supratek and its interesting, since they do made to order, and I see both the 6SN7 and DHT pre's. Considering that DHT have been praised by most true tube lovers the best option might be worthwhile to get Lyrita DHT and request Viren if he can give you a balanced input and output. I doubt if there will be too much of a difference. Considering your budget you can work with Viren for better transformers and volume pots.
Click to expand...

I checked on Conrad Johnson and their entry level was within budget but it had no XLR.

Will a buffer actually meet my goals? Sounds like it might not offer a "full" tube sound.

I usually use "digital volume", what I mean is that I use JRiver to control volume. The previous pre I bought, the Schiit, left me unimpressed.

Mr. Viren did not seem too interested in the XLR part or working with me after following this thread since I said I may only keep the equipment in my system for a brief period of time. I have posted this earlier in the thread that Lyrita is not an option. That part of my OP still stands, I intend to use the equipment for a brief period of time as a trial, only if I like it will it stay in my system. The Schiit saw very brief use in my system, I packed it up and put it in storage. I need to get around to selling it one of these days.

The Supratek can also come with the 300B, I have heard much about this tube, any thoughts arj?
 
If you just want to try tubes in your system, why don't you just borrow a preamp one from a friendly audiophile in your city and try it out for a few days ? To me this looks like an expensive way to just try something.

The " quintessential tube sound " may mean very different things to different people.

Good tube gear designers are usually tube audio craftsmen, engineer and music lover all rolled into one. That is where tube magic comes alive.

Btw, if you get in touch with Acoustic portrait, they can make one to your needs with XLR and all that pro jazz. They make absolutely brilliant preamps.
 
square_wave said:
If you just want to try tubes in your system, why don't you just borrow a preamp one from a friendly audiophile in your city and try it out for a few days ? To me this looks like an expensive way to just try something.

The " quintessential tube sound " may mean very different things to different people.

Good tube gear designers are usually tube audio craftsmen, engineer and music lover all rolled into one. That is where tube magic comes alive.

Btw, if you get in touch with Acoustic portrait, they can make one to your needs with XLR and all that pro jazz. They make absolutely brilliant preamps.
Click to expand...

I don't know anyone locally who is into audio/video. I also am a little concerned in case of damage or percieved damage, I don't want to get into that. I'd rather pay my own money, even if it is a trial than get into these possible complications.

I don't argue that it is about more than engineering.

I have spoken to Acoustic Portrait about their tube buffer previously, they declined on the XLR.
 
Decadent_Spectre said:
I don't know anyone locally who is into audio/video. I also am a little concerned in case of damage or percieved damage, I don't want to get into that. I'd rather pay my own money, even if it is a trial than get into these possible complications.

I don't argue that it is about more than engineering.

I have spoken to Acoustic Portrait about their tube buffer previously, they declined on the XLR.
Click to expand...
Okay. Why not talk to them for a new preamp with XLR.
 
If you want a typical tube sound with balanced inputs, check out Cary Audio SLP 05 pre
 
I have not heard this particular model. Heard a lower model with their power amp. It was a typical lush, tube sound.
 
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