Understanding the inconsistencies regarding what's considered derogatory as per forum rules

[Love4sound]

Even so, I only brought it up because a certain mod insisted I reread the rules implying that he somehow understands it & also takes them very seriously & that the person I reported was "countering my views in decent language" which arj agrees with. Ah yes, calling random FMs SJWs is somehow a civilized reply. This is laughable.

If mod agrees it’s a civil reply so be it. Some may take SJW offensive some don’t. You should just start using the forum the way it was intended to. I myself have violated forum rules at times and let go with a warning. They could have banned me but they decided not to be a strict police. Start some threads with your doubts related to audio/video, share your gears and you will connect with some very good people and have a pleasant experience in the forum.

 

[MediaEnthusiast]

If mod agrees it’s a civil reply so be it. Some may take SJW offensive some don’t. You should just start using the forum the way it was intended to. I myself have violated forum rules at times and let go with a warning. They could have banned me but they decided not to be a strict police. Start some threads with your doubts related to audio/video, share your gears and you will connect with some very good people and have a pleasant experience in the forum.

Yeah I don't mind that. But that would open a whole new can of worms. So that would mean mods should have zero problem with me calling random polite FMs as bhakts,etc & I should be considered civil too, right? I mean I don't consider it offensive, so why does it matter what my victim thinks? A simple yes/no from them would do. If they do say yes just to appear neutral, you already know that'd be the downfall of this forum.

You still got warnings. In this case, my report was entirety rejected & you know the rest in OP. Some rules aren't more important than others especially when you list that same rule multiple times and redirect users to read them.

 

[arj]

This forum has been doing very well for more than 15 years now with the current rules. Is it the newer demographics which is requiring changes Or is it expectations that we take slight too easily ?
I hope you are all members in Audioasylum which is the The forum on audio and it is far more brutal that what any of you are seeing here.

But again, if there is something to be added we can take cognisance but i am totally with Raghu when he said the below this is what we do in every other social media where we do not know who people really are..and are just a handle with some photo !

Its going to a near impossibility to develop a list of terms that should (or not) be used on public forums. This is not finite automata.
Having said this, I think participation on social media or dedicated forums needs one to develop one of these two:
1. Think skin
2. Zen-like ignoring capability

 

[MediaEnthusiast]

This forum has been doing very well for more than 15 years now with the current rules. Is it the newer demographics which is requiring changes Or is it expectations that we take slight too easily ?
I hope you are all members in Audioasylum which is the The forum on audio and it is far more brutal that what any of you are seeing here.

But again, if there is something to be added we can take cognisance but i am totally with Raghu when he said the below this is what we do in every other social media where we do not know who people really are..and are just a handle with some photo !

I fail to understand how that's relevant. It doesn't matter how other forums are, and like I said, I am grateful for you explaining your reasoning which in itself gave me the opportunity to bring up the contradictions in the first place.

Apologies for putting you in an uncomfortable position, but 3 different staff seemed to think that me being called SJW was alright for no reason. So I assume I should be allowed to say similar things to polite FMs, right?

 

[arj]

I fail to understand how that's relevant. It doesn't matter how other forums are, and like I said, I am grateful for you explaining your reasoning which in itself gave me the opportunity to bring up the contradictions in the first place.

Apologies for putting you in an uncomfortable position, but 3 different staff seemed to think that me being called SJW was alright for no reason. So I assume I should be allowed to do the same to other polite FMs, right?

I really dont know and guess its a personal thing as it obviously affected you badly since it has been brought up so many times . I would guess each of us just take it differently .

The mods here are voluntary and have day jobs and other things to do. we just volunteer our time because this forum has a value to all of us last thing we want to do is spend time moderating these flare-ups which can easily be avoided by all by keeping to the topic and ignoring those who dont. This is about the group moderating itself in some ways. we are all (hopefully) adults here.

And it does matter how other forums are since that gives an indication of what the outlook within any forum is and helps temper ones expectation ! I would say FMs here are far less abrasive than there..but again the level of details of some of the discussions there, are of a knowledge level we may never have since some of the industry thought leaders frequent that.

 

[MediaEnthusiast]

I really dont know and guess its a personal thing as it obviously affected you badly since it has been brought up so many times . I would guess each of us just take it differently .

The mods here are voluntary and have day jobs and other things to do. we just volunteer our time because this forum has a value to all of us last thing we want to do is spend time moderating these flare-ups which can easily be avoided by all by keeping to the topic and ignoring those who dont. This is about the group moderating itself in some ways.

Not really, but you can keep making this about me. Else I'd have reported 2 weeks ago. This is after my conversation with a fellow FM in a different thread. I expected my report to be rejected well in advance to prove a point. Some people are predictable.

Can I or can I not use similar words against polite FMs?

For a simple yes/no question, it sure is taking a long while. Let's not waste anybody's time with vague answers.

 

[firearm12]

Having said this, I think participation on social media or dedicated forums needs one to develop one of these two:
1. Think skin
2. Zen-like ignoring capability

Pity that I learned these things the harder way i.e. after marriage

 

[arj]

Can I or can I not use similar words against polite FMs?

Not sure I understand, you want to use a word you think is insulting against a fellow FM who is polite ?

Sounds like a horrible thing to me by intent ( not the word) but the mods may not stop you..am sure the Polite FMs may not want anything to do with you after that..I would not.

 

[firearm12]

Not really, but you can keep making this about me. Else I'd have reported 2 weeks ago. This is after my conversation with a fellow FM in a different thread. I expected my report to be rejected well in advance to prove a point. Some people are predictable.

Can I or can I not use similar words against polite FMs?

For a simple yes/no question, it sure is taking a long while. Let's not waste anybody's time with vague answers.

Ime, dictionary meaning of words is not a criteria to ban words, some 'skillful' people can sound really abusive without saying any provocative words also. So we cant outrightly ban certain words and then sit on the fence thinking grass will only grow greener inside. I am a music bhakt and will remain so until i cant hear anything or am not allowed to hear. Its all about what and how you feel about conversation. Even if you ban these words, someone will figure out way to hurl abuses, its all in context. I agree you felt bad and hurt, but really cant ask mods to ban words, even supreme court judges differ on opinion and here they are just mods. In our democracy, in order to win an election, it only matters that a person gets highest number of votes, it doesn't matter if 90% of people voted against him. He wins if he gets highest number of votes. That's how life is. Just chill and enjoy life lasts rather than feeling hurt from someone whose name also you don't know.

 

[MediaEnthusiast]

Not sure I understand, you want to use a word you think is insulting against a fellow FM who is polite ?

I'm asking if I'm permitted to use terms like SJW, bhakts against fellow FM who is polite. Considering 3 different staff including you didn't have a problem with it.

Sounds like a horrible thing to me by intent ( not the word)

It is horrible.

but the mods may not stop you.

Thank you. A clear "yes" yesterday would have saved us a lot of time. I have no further questions.

am sure the Polite FMs may not want anything to do with you after that..I would not.

I already recall me & my AC accidentally offending a bunch of uncles into posting fb tier memes & PJs simply for discouraging the use of crackers in the original thread and some guy even said something about protecting their culture from "us" LOL. I think I've enough people that may not want anything to do with me haha.

Ime, dictionary meaning of words is not a criteria to ban words, some 'skillful' people can sound really abusive without saying any provocative words also. So we cant outrightly ban certain words and then sit on the fence thinking grass will only grow greener inside. I am a music bhakt and will remain so until i cant hear anything or am not allowed to hear. Its all about what and how you feel about conversation. Even if you ban these words, someone will figure out way to hurl abuses, its all in context. I agree you felt bad and hurt, but really cant ask mods to ban words, even supreme court judges differ on opinion and here they are just mods. In our democracy, in order to win an election, it only matters that a person gets highest number of votes, it doesn't matter if 90% of people voted against him. He wins if he gets highest number of votes. That's how life is. Just chill and enjoy life lasts rather than feeling hurt from someone whose name also you don't know.

Exactly why I picked the word "bhakt" of all things. The literal definitions of SJW and bhakt are completely harmless. Unlike bhakt, SJW is only used in a belittling context which 3 different mods say wasn't derogatory yet one of them also said it was, weirdly.

I don't support the banning of any words. Only asked if I could use bhakt, etc in a belittling context towards polite FMs, which is kinda what happened with me. Simply calling someone a bhakt is not an insult, calling someone a bhakt in a political context is an insult which a mod says is not rule violation. Similarly, skillfully abusive comments of the same degree as SJW or bhakt should also logically not be rule violations.

I'm not that invested in this forum, so I don't know why they'd do that just to, umm, appear neutral? In any case, this was interesting.

 

[keith_correa]

If your report about being called SJW was rejected without explanation it just means ignorance on their part. Not that there's anything wrong in being ignorant in these dynamic times we're living in. I'm ignorant about so many things but one lives and learns. My take is that there will always be different interpretations of "name calling". What was acceptable previously no longer is these days.
Like SJW. AFAIK, it used to be complimentary in years gone by but is most definitely derogatory these days. The caller may have not been aware that it is derogatory these days - he/she must be clinging onto the old. Or not. It's the same for the Admins. Some are aware and some may not be. Can't blame them, like I said, this is all so very dynamic. Take "bhakt" for example. It used to be a harmless word but now is used to connote a mindless blind follower. Use your judgement well, think multiple times before using terms that may cause offense. If it could be taken as offensive, don't use the word even though it may not be meant to cause offence. What else can I say? Oh, and calling someone a bhakt, given that all of us except the most ignorant know what it's connotation is, is sure to get you a slap on the wrist if reported. On THAT, you can be sure, all admins WILL be on the same page.

Edit: Also, I suggest that you don't dwell on stuff like this - there are so many more interesting things to dwell upon. Like cables! And capacitors!

 

[raghupb]

@keith_correa!!
Cables and capacitors; good one

@MediaEnthusiast
On the above beaten topic of semantics:
In a card game, everyone knows the trio in English (King, Queen, Jack)
Now translate this into Hindi or any local language, the cool and trendy Jack becomes Gulaam (definitely derogatory).
So chill. Use the forum to explore weird things that happen in the audio/video world, specially audio

Cheers,
Raghu

 

[Kannan]

Like cables! And capacitors!

proves you truly are an Audio Bakth

 

[keith_correa]

proves you truly are an Audio Bakth

Audio Bhakth = AudioPhool. Phool = Flower. Hence, AudioFlower. Nice! But, isn't a Cauliflower a flower? Also, cauliflowers cause gas. Now it's Audio Bhakth = AudioPhool = AudioFlower = AudioFart! See how it goes?

 

[Nitin K]

Audio Bhakth = AudioPhool. Phool = Flower. Hence, AudioFlower. Nice! But, isn't a Cauliflower a flower? Also, cauliflowers cause gas. Now it's Audio Bhakth = AudioPhool = AudioFlower = AudioFart! See how it goes?

That must be a very musical one with more bass...

 

[MediaEnthusiast]

If your report about being called SJW was rejected without explanation it just means ignorance on their part. Not that there's anything wrong in being ignorant in these dynamic times we're living in. I'm ignorant about so many things but one lives and learns. My take is that there will always be different interpretations of "name calling". What was acceptable previously no longer is these days.
Like SJW. AFAIK, it used to be complimentary in years gone by but is most definitely derogatory these days. The caller may have not been aware that it is derogatory these days - he/she must be clinging onto the old. Or not. It's the same for the Admins. Some are aware and some may not be. Can't blame them, like I said, this is all so very dynamic.

The caller looked it up and was aware of the meaning and he made it pretty clear about his intent. The old definition, is not going to show up in the top google results. I did get an explanation for why it was rejected, I was told it's not considered derogatory by staff, but also one staff that admits it was indeed pejorative, which just means the same as derogatory. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

People get banned on this forum, so different interpretations by different mods is an issue I'd rather have sorted out now, than never.

Take "bhakt" for example. It used to be a harmless word but now is used to connote a mindless blind follower. Use your judgement well, think multiple times before using terms that may cause offense. If it could be taken as offensive, don't use the word even though it may not be meant to cause offence. What else can I say? Oh, and calling someone a bhakt, given that all of us except the most ignorant know what it's connotation is, is sure to get you a slap on the wrist if reported. On THAT, you can be sure, all admins WILL be on the same page.

That's why I made the thread. If SJW that is only ever used in a belittling context today against a polite FM for no reason is allowed as per multiple staff, so can bhakt and similar words, or more importantly other indirect comments of same degree. And therefore staff has said that twice that I and therefore anybody else in the forum will be allowed to use them. Surprising to see them go this route. Imo using petty insults would make me feel uncivilized, which is something I'd rather not live with.

On the above beaten topic of semantics:
In a card game, everyone knows the trio in English (King, Queen, Jack)
Now translate this into Hindi or any local language, the cool and trendy Jack becomes Gulaam (definitely derogatory).
So chill. Use the forum to explore weird things that happen in the audio/video world, specially audio

Cheers,
Raghu

Hey thanks for your concern man. I'm doing alright. It's just I'd rather have some things clear for myself if I'm going to be on this forum. Cheers!

 

[keith_correa]

There's nothing to clear in my opinion. You're not going to get a definitive answer with consensus from all. You WILL be at the mercy of the Admins and their interpretation of rules when it comes to that point. They're human and like us they will err at times. I just hope they don't err when it comes to me. Even if they do, no skin off my nose. If it comes to that: I'm arrogant enough to think - their loss!

 

[arj]

The problem was not just about name calling but looking at the posts objectively several folks have been posting some really personal attacks as well which were all deleted since they were childish and personal and every party culpable to it some have accepted it and I can already see a mature view coming forth.

These are never black and white situations

Anyway this horse has been beaten to death and am sure we are all adults here and we have seen worse in the real world and know how to deal with it with decorum .

Edit: Also, I suggest that you don't dwell on stuff like this - there are so many more interesting things to dwell upon. Like cables! And capacitors!

Funnily the majority of all this juvenile behaviour seems to happen mainly on the TV forum. Audio folks seem to be either too war scarred due to history to bother or its something else !

 

[raghupb]

<snip>
Funnily the majority of all this juvenile behaviour seems to happen mainly on the TV forum. Audio folks seem to be either too war scarred due to history to bother or its something else !

We are busy concentrating on cables, capacitors, connectors, chassis-stabilizers and coincidentally some content.
That's a lot of C's in audio parlance to deal with. So forgive us geeks
Cheers,
Raghu

 

[firearm12]

Audio folks seem to be either too war scarred due to history to bother or its something else !

Audio folks like to open up their own or others equipment and drool over it. They also have some supernatural issues to worry about. Worldly matters are a little of concern to them.