What is the secret of these speakers?

You mentioned about some F.A.S.T commercial speakers. Where are they available? Could you please direct me to some source?
Can not say about the source. But here are FAST like speakers. Meridian. 3" wide band + 6.5" woofer. Other option is to go DIY way. Narrow down your options. (either 12 inch FR or Intex like configuration) because that will have more probability of what sound you are seeking. There must be some members in Chennai who have such speakers. You are more experienced than me so out of respect I am saying auditioning before buying/building will be best way.
regards.
 
Maybe even the Accoustic portrait. Siva is himself an hindustani music lover and does actual recordings of live events. his speakers wouuld do india music like no other.
 
Its not the question of indian music or any other music first of all I can say the lows are present if a base guitar,japanese drum or last node of piano etc. which I think are less in music.Secoundly I am concerned about the mid range as human ear is aquented to it.Anyway I may be wrong its my personnel opinion.
 
Maybe even the Accoustic portrait. Siva is himself an hindustani music lover and does actual recordings of live events. his speakers wouuld do india music like no other.
I was keen on trying out his fr bookshelves but seems like they have discontinued them. I did get to listen to their huge floorstanders as well as their regular floorstanders and with music that I was carrying, including Indian classical music. Got a chance to even listen to their live recordings. It’s been a while but from what I can recollect their huge speakers did quite well with Indian classical music but might not be the sound rajafan is looking for.
 
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had spoken to him last month. he is relaunching some of his range early next year including some of the electronics. might be worth the wait !

Its not the question of indian music or any other music first of all I can say the lows are present if a base guitar,japanese drum or last node of piano etc. which I think are less in music.Secoundly I am concerned about the mid range as human ear is aquented to it.Anyway I may be wrong its my personnel opinion.

I am not very sure on the point you were trying to make, but even a 50 hz guitar has a 25hz sub harmonic along with a 100, 200.. Hz harmonic. it is all of this together which makes that sound individual to that equipment and different from a 50Hz of say a Sitar.

It funny , but lower the speaker goes cleanly, the better the midrange becomes due to the harmonics being richer. Have measured 20-25 Hz sound in my room (ignoring room effect) and also experienced the same using 2 REL subwoofers..which took me more than a month to get right.
 
I am sorry, but i am not able to understand the above. Arent all drums basically the same ie a stretched material, usually hide over a shell of wood and just that the shape and usage changes . So not sure why reproduction of a western drum is different from an india one.

As far as i know, Most drivers are designed scientifically to be flat and not specific for any instruments and hence not sure as to why they would want to make it all weird in the 70-200 Hz which is a very crucial range for mid bass/bass. A Speaker is of course a different matter

From what I know, Illayaraja himself is involved in the mastering of his songs and most studios do use "Western" studios.. eg Angel labs he has used in the UK uses ATC speakers. Not sure what studio he uses in chennai, but in most probability it would be a pro audio

Let me try to explain what was intended (i believe) by @rajafan

Our Traditional Instrument set, if you narrow down to south india, there will be a handful of them.
Mirudangam, Melam (Chenda, Urumi etc..), certain type of cymbals (similar to high hats, but played via hand), Nathaswaram (similar to trumpet, but with more body and less air), Authentic Bamboo Flute (not piccolos or Altos), Harmonium (similar to any reed based one, but compact enough to be carried around), Veena (Sitar in North and Central India) all of them exhibit one similarity. They sound very human like or very organic in their sound.
This is very unlike a Acoustic Guitar or Drum Kits, Sax / Trumpet, Voila, Pipe organs and Grand Piano. I am talking completely music and not frequencies. of course all the above said instruments can play most of the frequencies in their specific Octaves.

For example; the Different types of Percussion in India including Mirudangams, Melams, Dholak, Tabla, Thavil, Ghatam, all of them primarily operate in the Kick bass region. And almost all above said indian intstrument operate around the Human vocal region. So much that in any classical / folk concert here, the spectrum rarely comes below 100 Hz and goes above 10-12 Khz. This is why most of the traditional instruments can be spelled out or rather voiced out by any one with some background in music. They are called Konnakol (is the art of performing percussion syllables vocally) You could check this - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Konnakol

When you compare the variants in Western instrument, they have a far wide range of spectrum. An Acoustic guitar in a lower octave can dig pretty deep and the strums even get very near to lower 70 Hz freq. Similarly a Bass Guitar can operate at level where a subwoofer is a must to get the full experience of music. The Same guitar (Harp variants) can go well into the 16 Khz territory. Some electric version of these instruments extend their range even futher. Same applies for a Trumpet or any variant of this instrument (like clarinet, baritone etc..)

If you take African Music instruments, you ll notice a different pattern. They have a different set of instruments to cater to low, lower mid, mid and upper mid regions but the they kind of echo a distinct pattern.

It is just that different type of cultures coming up with their own set of instrument sets based on silo'ed evolution. Music directors all of the world, explore all types of genres hence will be using whatever suits the need at that point.

Generally, if you look at speakers, most of well known brands do produce linear, efficient speakers that should work for all types of music. But the inherent tone is something very specific to each brand / driver's brand. For example, great singers like SPB, Yesudas never appealed to Hindi audience even thought they were tried in few hindi movies. Similarly some of the great voices in Hindi never made it to Tamil or Telugu industry. I am still in era where ARR is playin Keyboard to Raja's tune. It is post ARR break that lot of people from either side crossed over. Hariharan, Shreya Goshal, Udit Narayan, Shankar Mahadevan etc..
Point is if the same song is sung by two well known personalities, both being equally proficient in music , and both sings the song as intended by the music director, still both will not 'sound' the same. The Tone is such a distinct element. Rajafan believes this essentially applies for instruments also.
 
Mi10, no arguments on the tone of the instruments and thanks for the writep..was quite informative.

The discussion is on the presentation of the tone and its deviation from original by a driver ( and not the whole speaker). In fact there would be minor difference even between instruments of the same type ie 2 different tablas can sound different. In fact 2 different tanpuras sound different from each other and ill wholeheartedly agree on that

The pattern you talk of is actually the combinations of the undertones and overtones from the fundamental which is what makes a 100 Hz sitar sound different from a 100hz guitar, or your voice different from mine doing the same musical scale.

The question is on its reproduction from a driver. one driver will not produce the tone of one drum better from the other instrument unless it is going beyond the freq range of the driver And because one is indian and the other is western ie the sound of a mridungam and that of a snare drum will be more or less equally distorted by a driver which does 30-500hz . not that the mridangam will sound better than the drum.in fact the tonality of some of our traditional drums are far more richer than the ones used in the west..eg the Ghanak of a tabla which extend to high frequencies is pretty unique and difficult to get right in a speaker .All good wideband drivers and only exceptionally designed multiway speakers can do that right

thats all i am saying..anyway we are digressing from the original discussion !
 
In my case with FRD playing crossover less, the sound is no longer confined to just the size of 8" drivers. It becomes a wall of sound on each side.

A linear loudspeaker (single-way or multi-way) irrespective or with or without crossover are all equally capable.

Can members make me understand the logic/science behind these little speakers producing such a sound singnature?

It is all about 'Voicing' of speakers. Though there are certain industry standard house curves, many designers follow their own.
All speakers design follow the same science, depends on how accurate it is in attaining a linear curve across the bandwidth and the 'Voice' tweak applied by the designer.
Then there are variables like cone material, magnet type etc. that go into designing a driver.

Please visit the owner of Torvin. If I recall correctly, he has similar music taste too. Loved his few pair of tower speakers.
From your signature, you are using LSR305 and T10. At one point of time, I wanted to try Presonus E6 and T10. But I was hesitant that they are Studio monitors. How do you find them? Will they suit my needs? Tough to make them sing?

I guess..you nailed it...to each his own...some people like distortion by design...and it is not a flaw...but a blessing i guess...
I have home theater friends..they love bass and distortion and they refute my clean sounding system as it is not enchanting to them....

I totally disagree with you. Generally, there is a tendency to brush aside valid opinions with generic comments. When I describe the signature, I compare it to the original tone, timbre and dynamics of a live instrument. Probably you have missed few of my earlier replies.
With great respect, I disagree. I clearly described the sound signature in the second paragraph. A perfect instrument to describe that sound signature is Melam. You would have heard it live many times in marriage halls and temples. Standing just 5 feet away from it will produce the exact sound signature I described “layered, bouncing, tight, deep, heavy and slamming”

These little speakers produce everything except the slamming due to the nature of small drivers. Do you think a speaker that produces as close as possible to the natural sound is colored? I would like to know how differently it sounds in a setup you prefer. I have listened to Full Rangers from 8 to 15”, sealed, ported and open baffle. They have huge sound stage, superb mids and highs but lack the lows denying the natural slamming of the Melam.
Let me give you another example. In my observation, Tabla has four layers of sound.

  1. First layer is tinny highs
  2. Second layer is wooden mids
  3. Third layer is mid bass
  4. Fourth layer is bass

There are different type of Tablas with different sound and dynamics. But in general, they have prominent frequency range from 70hz to 7Khz with 70 to 200 playing important role.

The speakers I have used and auditioned have certain characteristics. Few can produce 1 and 2, few 1 and 4, few 2 and 4. The FR drivers can produce 1,2 and 3 but lacking in 4.

But these little speakers produce all 4. It brings the whole body of music making me to crack my head and wanting me to upscale this model.

Tell me where I am looking for a distorted or coloured sound.
 
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The question is on its reproduction from a driver. one driver will not produce the tone of one drum better from the other instrument unless it is going beyond the freq range of the driver And because one is indian and the other is western ie the sound of a mridungam and that of a snare drum will be more or less equally distorted by a driver which does 30-500hz . not that the mridangam will sound better than the drum.in fact the tonality of some of our traditional drums are far more richer than the ones used in the west..eg the Ghanak of a tabla which extend to high frequencies is pretty unique and difficult to get right in a speaker .All good wideband drivers and only exceptionally designed multiway speakers can do that right

thats all i am saying..anyway we are digressing from the original discussion !

Ok ! now i got you sir. My bad, pardon my wrong usage of the word. The Tone i am referring is not literal meaning of 'Tone' or a 'musical note' i am referring to the Texture of a Sound / Tone. The Texture of a sound cannot be quantified or measured. They will only be subjectively judged between extremely likable to complete dislike.
What you have stated above is the distortion happening due to a said range of freq handled by the driver which is not supposed to completely handle them.
But yeah i think your statements are completely valid if i understand the statement with the literal meaning of 'Tone'
 
kannan, would giving a bump at the 50-250 range make speakers sound "bigger" ?
A bigger sound is not restricted to any specific frequency bandwidth. It is about overall coherence, phase and placement.
 
hi flute, you'd be surprised at the amount of music present in the 20-30Hz region. if you have not heard it, then you can enjoy the music even without it, but once you hear it, you will really miss it if its not there

My speaker goes down to 29 Hz and i can hear a small bass thread on some tracks.With a full range that becomes essential to the music since its that thread which provides the background continuity to music. I never heard it with my previous bookshelves until i put to subs on to it and after that cannot stand those tracks without the bass !

eg Unplugged by Clapton. Dire straits albums even some vocals which sound like acapella on a usual speaker but with a base undertone on a full range which completely changes the experience.

The sub just tries to do that, But it needs to be a good sub which articulates the notes of the bass and not the thump at a single frequency which only ruins the experience. no sub is preferred for that. The thumb rule for a sub is that you should not hear it when on but miss it when off :)

But again, most indian music do not go that low so for that a 35Hz bottom end is perfectly fine

In some two way speakers I've experienced that the volume needs to be high to get good bass punch (subject to the song, and personal taste). But if you've a sub, the bass can be adjusted independent of the volume of the mids and you get a more punch at relatively lower volume?
 
when you look at integerating a sub, you nee to look at the 2Qs Quality and Quantity. Quality shown how clean and articulate the bass is ie you can hear the bass notes individually. Quantity is the Punch you get but many folks over do the punch

the key phrase is..when the sub is on you do not notice it, but when off you miss it :)
 
MY opinion is rajafan is looking at speakers which have cones made of paper . Earlier in those days we had philips mid ranges and paper tweeters . Best is to start with boston hi q range i suppose
 
I wonder how Ilayaraja's songs would sound on Devialet phantom.
Here is an excerpt from the PCmag review (https://in.pcmag.com/speakers/115397/devialet-silver-phantom):
Bill Callahan's "Drover," a track with far less deep bass in the mix, gives us a better sense of the overall sound signature. The drums on this track can sound overly thunderous on systems that boost the bass too much and like thin tapping on systems that don't reproduce much low-end. Through the Silver Phantom, the drums sound natural—there's definitely a little bit of added bass depth, but nothing over the top. Callahan's baritone vocals have a rich low-mid presence here, and also receive plenty of treble edge, giving them some added contour. This is a crisp, well-defined sound with some realistic bass presence. There's not much that the Silver Phantom overly boosts.
 
Drivers are never voiced. Speakers are.
AFAIK, there is no "house" sound from driver manufacturers but many speaker manufacturers target this.
Frequency response is not the only thing that contributes to the sound of a driver. Distortion also plays a big role. Some people like the sound of distortion - maybe that's what you're after?
 
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