Anyone heard the new kef R series

[raghupb]

@newlash09
What is the change you are seeking from the PMCs? By design, PMC should do bass and LF texturing very well.
If they have a good midrange drive as @square_wave says they should be a good match.

Coming to KEF R300s, the reference that I can speak from, the first thing you'll notice is the Uni-Q.
In my setup, I don't even bother to toe-in. The centering/imaging is freaky and soundstage/dispersion is wide.
They are by no stretch of imagination warm or laid back. In fact, if the track is aggressive they can be quite rowdy.
Metal/rock/pop can bring out their visceral nature, but in a good way.

For the staple rock and blues genre, that all three at home listen to regularly, they quite peppy and fast.
Pure vocals from old Hindi/Kannada film recordings sound very full and soulful.
Western classical, well recorded, is as close to a concert feel in my tiny apartment.
Wife and I both feel that Carnatic or Hindustani vocals or instrumentals are presented well.
When auditioning, choose a very wide variety of music types to assess in room behavior.

Please read the review of Reference 1 by FM @sidvee from a couple of years ago.

Kef Reference 1

Please see link to the review: KEF Reference 1 Speaker Review Cheers, Sid

www.hifivision.com

Cheers,
Raghu

 

[newlash09]

@newlash09
What is the change you are seeking from the PMCs? By design, PMC should do bass and LF texturing very well.
If they have a good midrange drive as @square_wave says they should be a good match.

Coming to KEF R300s, the reference that I can speak from, the first thing you'll notice is the Uni-Q.
In my setup, I don't even bother to toe-in. The centering/imaging is freaky and soundstage/dispersion is wide.
They are by no stretch of imagination warm or laid back. In fact, if the track is aggressive they can be quite rowdy.
Metal/rock/pop can bring out their visceral nature, but in a good way.

For the staple rock and blues genre, that all three at home listen to regularly, they quite peppy and fast.
Pure vocals from old Hindi/Kannada film recordings sound very full and soulful.
Western classical, well recorded, is as close to a concert feel in my tiny apartment.
Wife and I both feel that Carnatic or Hindustani vocals or instrumentals are presented well.
When auditioning, choose a very wide variety of music types to assess in room behavior.

Please read the review of Reference 1 by FM @sidvee from a couple of years ago.

Kef Reference 1

Please see link to the review: KEF Reference 1 Speaker Review Cheers, Sid

www.hifivision.com

Cheers,
Raghu

Thanks a lot for sharing sidvee's review raghu...Was a very interesting read indeed and very well written too. I have been a bass head all my life. And been happy with the pmc for these genres which I listen to most. But I guess Iam getting old now

I find myself listening to a lot of female vocals these days. And only now I realize that pmc have traded weight for speed. So it is a lean presentation, with all the details, neutrality and transparency still there in the mix of course. But I would still want more weight in the vocals and the strings. So this has started the urge to try some thing new. I guess I might have to trade bass performance in the bargain. But fondly hoping it will not be too much of a downgrade in the bass department, in search of more prominent vocals, with more weight to them.

 

[newlash09]

Please do a home audition before you decide. I feel the KEF will be a sideways move ( in terms of resolving capability in mids and highs ) since you already have a really good speaker from PMC which comes with a stellar midrange driver. If you crave more quality bass, why not consider couple of subs from the likes of REL, Rhythmic etc ? This will open up the mids also.

You have a class A krell beast. I am sure it will all work well together if you connect the RELs using the high level speaker inputs.

Thanks for the advise square wave

Even I had the same thoughts about it being a sideways move. But honestly Iam looking for a difference in presentation, that an out right improvement.

Whatever I buy next, will surely be after a audition only. Might not always be possible to get a in home demo, but will atleast check out stuff in the showroom. Iam pretty sure I can make out what I like if I hear it once. So this will be just to see what other stuff out there sound like, and if I end up liking them. So the kef R11 are among my list of probables, as are the focal sopra no.2's. But cheaper the better

So I started this thread on the kef

 

[sridharpoli]

Thanks for all the info on the KEFs folks.

 

[hifitoaster]

so Kef R3 are better than Kef R300?

Yes. A friend of mine has R300, I have auditioned R3 few months ago. To me it sounded R3 is a more perfected R300. Its less harsh, less metal tweeter sounding than R300. Its more than enough to consider R3 over R300 as vocals sound more natural with this. I had listened the R300 with a Arcam amp and R3 with a Rotel. Its not apples to apples, but knowing Rotel and Arcam from other setups, I think I am not wrong here with the assesment. Also, the grill looked very good in person than in pics.

 

[prem]

Newlash09, I am not familiar with either PMC or KEF. What I know is PMC is a respected brand in pro stuff. Their drivers are very good. Maybe you should experiment with an amp which is more powerful or has a different damping factor. This whole amp speaker synergy is a black hole. Tread carefully.

 

[raghupb]

Yes. A friend of mine has R300, I have auditioned R3 few months ago. To me it sounded R3 is a more perfected R300. Its less harsh, less metal tweeter sounding than R300. Its more than enough to consider R3 over R300 as vocals sound more natural with this. I had listened the R300 with a Arcam amp and R3 with a Rotel. Its not apples to apples, but knowing Rotel and Arcam from other setups, I think I am not wrong here with the assesment. Also, the grill looked very good in person than in pics.

Very well said. In the brief time I listened to it, vocals/mids and highs were better than R300.
Bass as I mentioned could not be assessed.

Cheers,
Raghu

 

[Rosenarayanappa]

Anyone paired r3 with rega amp(brio). Got concept 20s for now. Thinking of upgrading to either these or p3esr.

 

[newlash09]

Newlash09, I am not familiar with either PMC or KEF. What I know is PMC is a respected brand in pro stuff. Their drivers are very good. Maybe you should experiment with an amp which is more powerful or has a different damping factor. This whole amp speaker synergy is a black hole. Tread carefully.

Thanks for the very very valid advise prem

Iam in fact trying tubes for the first time as a last ditched effort to add that weight in the mid range that I seek. Fondly hope it works, as id hate to see these great speakers go. Will tread carefully as advised. Thanks again

 

[raghupb]

Anyone paired r3 with rega amp(brio). Got concept 20s for now. Thinking of upgrading to either these or p3esr.

Have heard Brio with R300. The speakers were hungry for more.
If choosing R3, upgrade amp to Elicit-R. They need this 3dB headroom at least.
Brio with P3ESR is a great match.
Cheers,
Raghu

 

[square_wave]

Thanks for the advise square wave

Even I had the same thoughts about it being a sideways move. But honestly Iam looking for a difference in presentation, that an out right improvement.

Whatever I buy next, will surely be after a audition only. Might not always be possible to get a in home demo, but will atleast check out stuff in the showroom. Iam pretty sure I can make out what I like if I hear it once. So this will be just to see what other stuff out there sound like, and if I end up liking them. So the kef R11 are among my list of probables, as are the focal sopra no.2's. But cheaper the better

So I started this thread on the kef

Dome midranges are known to give good weight to the midrange. I have heard ATC’s with those kind of drivers and I felt the midrange was their strong point. All your other gear seems to be stellar. Like prem, mentioned, tread with care now. I think you should have some discussions with people who have a lot of experience with your speaker. I certainly think that speaker setup, acoustics considerations and cables should be where you should focus on. This can be a total merry go round otherwise.

Unless the PMC model you have is known for a lean presentation by design.

 

[newlash09]

Dome midranges are known to give good weight to the midrange. I have heard ATC’s with those kind of drivers and I felt the midrange was their strong point. All your other gear seems to be stellar. Like prem, mentioned, tread with care now. I think you should have some discussions with people who have a lot of experience with your speaker. I certainly think that speaker setup, acoustics considerations and cables should be where you should focus on. This can be a total merry go round otherwise.

Unless the PMC model you have is known for a lean presentation by design.

Thanks again square wave

Yeah the pmc 20 series are known to be a lean speaker. I have heard the ATC's before. And they have a lot of weight in the mid range. The pmc don't have that. And the pmc were also designed with a deliberate dip in the 1000 to 2400 Hz frequency range to set that mid range back a bit. So that the speakers can be run at huge volumes without sounding shouty. I guess I will try to use the eq in roon to bump up that exact range a bit and see if it delivers the desired results. Thanks again

 

[alphacentury100]

Check this out:

Z-Review about the Ker R3. This guy has a unique style of reviewing A/V Equipments in his dedicated Hometheatre HOUSE

 

[newlash09]

Thanks a lot for sharing that alphacentury

Unfortunately Iam travelling and have a restricted access to the internet. So can't acess videos here with my limited bandwidth. But will surely check it out once I get acess. Thanks again. Much appreciated.

 

[prem]

newlash09, get your speakers a bit closer and see what happens. From what you are saying, I feel the correct integration of all frequencies is not happening. I seriously doubt it’s the speakers. It could be a room/placement issue.

 

[raghupb]

@newlash09
Does the Devialet amp have SAM support for PMC?
If so, have you tried it?
Cheers,
Raghu

 

[newlash09]

newlash09, get your speakers a bit closer and see what happens. From what you are saying, I feel the correct integration of all frequencies is not happening. I seriously doubt it’s the speakers. It could be a room/placement issue.

Thanks again prem

Will give that a try once I complete building my rack. With all the boxes spread out in between, Iam unable to move them any closer. Besides, I also sit very close to the speakers at about 6 feet max. So maybe that could also be a issue. I will have to try to dismantle my daughters bed, behind my seating position. In order to sit farther away from the speakers. But even I felt that I could be sitting too close, so Iam hearing individual drivers, instead of the musical whole.

Iam attaching a pic of my room. Actually my daughter's room

The room is around 15 x15 feet. So I think the speakers are spaced out about 9 feet apart. And I sit around 6 ft from each speakers in the middle. My daughter's bed is behind my listening position.. I have added a very thick and Wooly carpet, as the room is bare , bright and full of reverb. I wish I could tame the room, but have to keep aesthetics in mind also, as my daughter is already horrified with what I done there already

 

[newlash09]

@newlash09
Does the Devialet amp have SAM support for PMC?
If so, have you tried it?
Cheers,
Raghu

Good morning raghu

The D-premier does not support SAM profiles, though they are available for my speakers. It came in the subsequent iterations I guess.

 

[raghupb]

Good morning raghu

The D-premier does not support SAM profiles, though they are available for my speakers. It came in the subsequent iterations I guess.

Ah. Bummer!!
The approach and tech behind SAM sounds interesting though
Cheers,
Raghu

 

[prem]

Hi newlash09, get the speakers closer so that they are between 6-7 feet. How far are the speakers from the wall behind it?

What rug is it? Looks like an acrylic one. That’s a no no. You need to use a natural fibre rug. Like cotton, wool, jute, silk