• Hello and Welcome to HiFiVision.com - an online community for the home entertainment and tech enthusiasts!

    If you would like to ask a question, participate in a discussion and view attachments please Register yourself.

car speakers have 2way, 3way, 4way and even 5way .... any significant change in SQ or performance

Naveenbnc

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 12, 2016
Messages
1,338
Points
83
Location
Hyderabad
Hello All,

I saw car speakers with even 5-way design. (woofer+mid+tweeter+2 super tweeters)
Did any of you observe significant upgrade in SQ compared to simple 2 way?

Or is it only marketing strategy to attract buyers ???
 
SPONSORED ADS

SPONSORED ADS

Dr.Lakshay

Active Member
Joined
Apr 7, 2017
Messages
360
Points
43
Location
Ghaziabad
Hello All,

I saw car speakers with even 5-way design. (woofer+mid+tweeter+2 super tweeters)
Did any of you observe significant upgrade in SQ compared to simple 2 way?

Or is it only marketing strategy to attract buyers ???
I have auditioned good as well as bad 2way, 3way and 4way. I will say in the end it all comes down to the choice of equipment, installation and tuning.
I have audition a 3way audison setup which was very costly as compared to my setup but still all it could achieve was spl and no sq. While my humble 3way (including sub) can beat it in sq but not spl.
 

kapvin

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 23, 2009
Messages
985
Points
63
Location
Mumbai/ Thane
Hello All,

I saw car speakers with even 5-way design. (woofer+mid+tweeter+2 super tweeters)
Did any of you observe significant upgrade in SQ compared to simple 2 way?

Or is it only marketing strategy to attract buyers ???
Hi Naveen,

the problem with Multiway in cars is that the component distances are mostly far apart, esp, when compared to distance between speaker driver and listener. With dsp and delay you can time align it so that there is a sweet spot for one listener, and potentially wonderful sound, but all other listeners will suffer uneven response due to comb-filtering. The more components, the more problems.

In my solitary and very humble opinion, the best compromise is a 4" coax (or small component w/ mid &tweeter v. close)handling 150hz upwards mounted on a pod in the dash, (going through a proper crossover with delay on the tweeter, and a 6"woofer/ sub mounted in the door panel with proper damping. (I've used the tangband 1139, but you can find similar, remember cabin gain really is your friend). this should give you a fairly good front soundstage. the moment you do rear set (or fills, that is both soundstage and even response gone).

Of course, I write this because this is hifivision, and I am hoping the objective is to get tonal accuracy. The Car audio gang might differ significantly on perspective, but mostly their objectives are different). ANd, as ever, YMMV
 

Naveenbnc

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 12, 2016
Messages
1,338
Points
83
Location
Hyderabad
I guess my question is too generic. Because too many models are out there in every design.

But lately based on an advise, i learnt that separate component speakers can be better than 2 way, 3way, etc
 

greenhorn

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2009
Messages
1,692
Points
113
Location
OMR, Chennai
if you are talking about 3 way components for fronts, they absolutely make sense if feasible, but higher drivers may not bring as much benefits
if you are talking about those coaxial speakers having multiple piezo tweeters is just marketing show off :p
 

yogibear

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 31, 2014
Messages
1,638
Points
113
Location
Jaipur
From acoustic perspective, coaxials and seprate woofers will give best sonic impressions. The vintage JBLs car drivers are jaw dropping and are coaxials.
 

Kannan

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 13, 2008
Messages
1,460
Points
113
Location
Chennai
Coaxial speakers are basically a design that has been prevalent from the 50's to address the short comings of full range drivers, but still maintaining the directivity.
But it never became mainstream as overcoming the short comings was an expensive approach.

However the cheaper car coaxs (2-way, 3-way or more) are just drivers mounted around a main woofer without proper calibration. They will sound loud, but lack in clarity and will easily distort at higher volumes, .

The well engineered 2-way coaxials like the KEFs or some of the vintage drivers have their own limitations like edge diffraction, sibilance, overlaps and other issues, and will mostly need either equing or zobel networks.
KEF is one company which has retained focus in this direction.

But most coaxials do certain things well like imaging, because these act like point source drivers.

In car it is a popular design as you don't have to use multiple speakers, but a big compromise in sound quality, but fine for a casual listener.

@Naveenbnc If you want to try the cheap coax car drivers at home as they are cheap, you are going to be disappointed big time if you are after sound quality and not quantity.
Most of these drivers are high spl with very weak voice coil, so don't run them off any high power amplifier. They are designed to be powered by low profile car head units.
Car inherently has lots of cabin gain unlike in a room, so the lows tend to be exaggerated and liked by many.

As I used to do a lot of DIY in my younger days, from my experience, I suggest you don't keep jumping before perfecting the one you have already built in hand to suit your listening taste.
As the sound improves while you make the modifications, you will get a first hand experience of what effect each mod has...
for example, you will get to learn, how a simple change in quantity of enclosure damping changes which frequencies of the sound
I guess you have built 2 to 3 speakers. Work around these first.

@liverpool_for_life (Mr. Raghu) who has a 3-way full active setup with Seaton Speakers (both 2-channel and HT) has been correcting his room with professional help and has seen the sound improve by leaps and bounds. I spent almost 3 hours auditioning his setup last week and the movie experience was exhilarating. But the acoustic correction work is still in progress. So most often it is not the speakers, but alo the room that clutters the sound.
Similarly very important is the quality of the source. Many change components randomly based on the listening from poor source quality.

My approach is usually to set a budget, and try and work within it. Also since my approach is only multi-way, it makes it easier to work within its constrains. I am though currently using a 2-way passive at home and a 4-way active in car.
 
Last edited:

kapvin

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 23, 2009
Messages
985
Points
63
Location
Mumbai/ Thane
Coaxial speakers are basically a design that has been prevalent from the 50's to address the short comings of full range drivers, but still maintaining the directivity.
But it never became mainstream as overcoming the short comings was an expensive approach.

However the cheaper car coaxs (2-way, 3-way or more) are just drivers mounted around a main woofer without proper calibration. They will sound loud, but lack in clarity and will easily distort at higher volumes, .

The well engineered 2-way coaxials like the KEFs or some of the vintage drivers have their own limitations like edge diffraction, sibilance, overlaps and other issues, and will mostly need either equing or zobel networks.
KEF is one company which has retained focus in this direction.

But most coaxials do certain things well like imaging, because these act like point source drivers.

In car it is a popular design as you don't have to use multiple speakers, but a big compromise in sound quality, but fine for a casual listener.

@Naveenbnc If you want to try the cheap coax car drivers at home as they are cheap, you are going to be disappointed big time if you are after sound quality and not quantity.
Most of these drivers are high spl with very weak voice coil, so don't run them off any high power amplifier. They are designed to be powered by low profile car head units.
Car inherently has lots of cabin gain unlike in a room, so the lows tend to be exaggerated and liked by many.

As I used to do a lot of DIY in my younger days, from my experience, I suggest you don't keep jumping before perfecting the one you have already built in hand to suit your listening taste.
As the sound improves while you make the modifications, you will get a first hand experience of what effect each mod has...
for example, you will get to learn, how a simple change in quantity of enclosure damping changes which frequencies of the sound
I guess you have built 2 to 3 speakers. Work around these first.

My approach is usually to set a budget, and try and work within it. Also since my approach is only multi-way, it makes it easier to work within its constrains. I am though currently using a 2-way passive at home and a 4-way active in car.

Most coaxed in car audio are simply a first order highpass attached to the tweeter and the mid running without any filter. That contributes to the mush as the cone break up etc, contribute to the overall sound, but many coax, when fitted with a well designed crossover can sound a lot better, the tweeter will be cleaner with 2nd order filter and so will the woofer.

I made a naive assumption that the OP would do some customisation. Especially in a car, crossover has to be specific to the location of the car, since the drivers are at different distances yet very close to the listener. The closest analogy is a near field mixing desk that they typically have small 2 ways filled out by a sub.

If I read the question about a kit 2way, 3 way etc, there is still no definitive answer, while a multi-way might sound cleaner due to each speaker having a narrower pass band, but there will be smeared sound due to different time of arrival from each component and it will not be tonally accurate.

If you are not building a passive crossover from scratch for the car the only correct way to do multi-way is by doing it actively. And as a side rant having more than one supertweeteris only for sizzle ( or for the ice installer to make money), it’s not going to be accurate.

Of course, there are many who say, that multi-way —it sounds good. And they are right. What you like is what you should get. The ice gangs will tune the car by ear. And I am not deriding that at all. If it sounds good to you and is non fatiguing , then it’s the right decision.

Personally, I am a big fan of multi-way. But in the home, where there is enough distance between the speaker and listener for the sound to “sum”

Ps. I did do a 4 way active in my optra about 7 years ago. Took a lot of time to get it right. Pulled it all out and replaced it with hertz 2ways when I gave my car to my dad. You could still probably find the build thread on gear heads.

Edit: here it is. You can see how I made the journey from passive to active. Undocumented is the final part of the he active journey.
http://gearheads.in/showthread.php?11263-Optra-Magnum-Semi-DIY-ICE-install
 
Last edited:

Naveenbnc

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 12, 2016
Messages
1,338
Points
83
Location
Hyderabad
Dear Kannan & Kapvin,

Thanks a lot for all the time and so many inputs.
I have to read them a few times to understand better ...
 
SPONSORED ADS
SPONSORED ADS

Top