changing the goal posts in loudspeaker design

suri

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while everything has changed so much, and while the world is moving towards a perfect source of music (storage,retrieval, and delivery), loudspeaker design has not changed much - one hears of software which optimizes cross-over design and cabinet volume and dimensions and placement of drivers, but there is no fundamental change ( even if one considers planars and line-array) - the best are still (massive and inert) coffin-boxes. (an exception,{and one that i have heard} and a superb one at that, is the EMERALD PHYSICS loudspeaker)

so, the question posed is this -

if a person wanted to design a loudspeaker that bested the best of the lot, how must he/she proceed? - where does one start and how does one proceed?
 
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IMHO all current "designs" are being explored to their limits (planar/box/electro/open baffle) etc. The true breakthrough is still to be made for anew design..

have you thought of the Linkwitz Orion/pluto as an option ?
 
hi cranky,
hehe

actually (and apart from the fact that most loudspeakers are ugly rectangular boxes) i meant to ask " in the near future, is digital signal processing and active amplification going to become a common feature in the loudspeakers commonly available"

in recent times, i have heard many more people talking about this than just some time ago, and have also seen that emerald physics has been able to make a well-rounded loudspeaker with two drivers on an open baffle.

when i started thinking about loudspeakers (and when the goalposts were so far away, i could not see them) the best had well designed passive cross-overs and massive inert cabinets. Now, just as those old goal-posts are within striking distance, i fear they are going to further away (and out of sight again for me) with all this DSP and active amplification.

i, therefore, meant to ask - " should i be giving up these passive designs and start thinking (and learning) about active designs?"

the reluctance (and vacillation) about this step is on many accounts-

-the learning curve could be steep and could prove to be expensive

-in a two way with two amplifiers - since amplifiers have their particular sound signature (even identical items) would the result be a bastard sound? and would this problem not be compounded in a three way?

- and lastly, are these active designs better than the best passive designs?

about the external aesthetics of loudspeakers - very few want to tread a different path - Bang and Olufsen comes to mind, and kef created a disaster with the muon.

regds

edit - that digimoda, judging by it's price ($1200 x 2) should be good - one is paying $400 for each amplified channel!

edit - zaph audio rates the revelator line higher than the illuminator line
http://www.zaphaudio.com/6.5test/
 
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Hello, very interesting thoughts from all of you. Correctly put by Cranky. However the problem begins with the recording process itself. Once somebody told me we must look at current microphone and techniques as encryption devices, the recordings as bad compressed copies, playback devices as bad decompression and loudspeakers as the guilty decryption/translation devices.
nosortf
 
Hi,

Suri, I will not add anything to this debate as it may lead something else ;)!!

If you have set your mind on some digital thingy then this link below may of some use to you !!

Mini DSP

Regards.
 
Hello Cranky, this brings me to the second part of my post. Now having established the dream of LIVE is not attainable, let us come to ALMOST LIFELIKE as a more obtainable goal. I think this too an unobtainable goal. Hence the most obtainable goal is the most enjoyable sound in our living space. With regards to loudspeakers, more so that any of the other parts of a playback system, the room as mentioned by you earlier limits us.

Distortion in loudspeakers is another aspect overlooked too.These Distortions are Accurate wavelaunch in terms of size along with SPL. Time distortion in deflected and reflected energies. Enclosure distortions. Mechanical distortions.

Now let us come to loudspeakers and their various design goal posts. Each approach is with merits as well as problems, there is no absolute best. We all want different things from our husbands/wives, the same for loudspeakers.

I can however mention that for classical and jazz music I have heard a single way loudspeaker of a completely different technology, that removes most of the problems and is far closer to the goal post than most. It is however beyond DIY attempts.
nosortf
 
Hello Cranky, I consider LIFELIKE unattainable too, not as a design goal but as a physical limitation especially in terms of size. Like you talk about the 6 piece drum set, not attainable.
I am a jazz and classical listener and the speaker I mentioned suits me fine. Some pop music I heard sounded bass shy as the speaker is not a box type, however for my music the bass was correct.
nosortf
 
I can however mention that for classical and jazz music I have heard a single way loudspeaker of a completely different technology, that removes most of the problems and is far closer to the goal post than most. It is however beyond DIY attempts

Hi Nosortf,

Could you tell us curious folks some details(name,type size,etc) of this speaker?

Regards
Rajiv
 
Hello Suri, it is beyond DIY only in technology and not money.Money I cannot comment as I am incompetent to talk about financial aspects in manufacturing. I plan to buy this speaker and am in serious talks with a dealer for supply of the same. I will inform the people of the details when the deal is done.
 
Hello Cranky, the dealer requested me to keep the thing limited till I finalize. I do not see how it matters but I shall respect his wish. I can say that it has the most open sound I have heard from a speaker product, actually closer to how instruments would sound rather than a speaker.
nosortf
 
Hello Suri, it is beyond DIY only in technology and not money.Money I cannot comment as I am incompetent to talk about financial aspects in manufacturing. I plan to buy this speaker and am in serious talks with a dealer for supply of the same. I will inform the people of the details when the deal is done.

good luck nosortf, this is exactly the situation that i would have loved to be in!

but you must invite me to (vicariously) enjoy once you have set it up.

regds,
suri
 
Hi nosortf,
All the best for your deal. :)

By the way did you choose your name 'nosortf' from...
nos (Microphone system) and ortf (Stereo technique). If you wish you may not answer this, but I was just little bit curious.
regards
Hiten
 
Hello Cranky, the dealer requested me to keep the thing limited till I finalize. I do not see how it matters but I shall respect his wish. I can say that it has the most open sound I have heard from a speaker product, actually closer to how instruments would sound rather than a speaker.
nosortf

looking forward to hearing more on this...curiosity is definitely Piqued ! :)
 
Hi nosortf,
All the best for your deal. :)

By the way did you choose your name 'nosortf' from...
nos (Microphone system) and ortf (Stereo technique). If you wish you may not answer this, but I was just little bit curious.
regards
Hiten

Hello Hiten, impressively close. Both are the national broadcasting houses for Netherlands (NOS Nederlandse Omroep Stichting) and France(ORTF Office de Radiodiffusion Tlvision Franaise). Both developed very similar cardiod microphone techniques for stereo live broadcast and recordings, The techniques were named after their houses. Are you a studio engineer as only a studio engineer would realise this name I have chosen.
nosortf
 
Hello Cranky, I don't think there will be a beeline for the product as I don't think many people will like the sound of it. Dealers have their own reasons for secrecy I think. I will invite all when the product is with me.
nosortf
 
Hello, relating to Suri's search for DIY dream project with conventional type loudspeakers. An audio type just told me a perfect project would be a sealed two way type using a simple passive crossover and going to 100-150hz, and an active sealed sub woofer for frequencies below that. He mentioned a speaker called the Infinty Modulus should be the aim.
nosortf
 
Are you a studio engineer as only a studio engineer would realise this name I have chosen.
nosortf
I am not a studio engineer. :lol: That's Hilarious .... I am laughing at myself imagining that...

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Audio/hifi knowledge wise you will not find more ignorant member than me In HIFIVISION. (See my queries in DIY section :p)
Regarding finding your name ? Lets say Yesterday I had lot of time to explore the net. ;)
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"A studio Engineer" That will be the day :eek:hyeah:
 
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