Clash of the Titans - Vintage Altec Vs. Vintage Tannoys - My DIY experiences

[cybervinay]

I am going to share my experience on these vintage speakers and building cabinet designs for these. I have acquired the Tannoy monitor gold 12" speakers and narrowed in on the GRF rectangular cabs. I could not place the corner horns otherwise I would have built that. I initially built the cabs as test one as I wanted to listen to the driver and then decide if it works. Once initially completed I noticed that there was bass boominess and cabinet was resonating.

So after listening to it for few weeks I decided to fix it and re-enforced it with 3/4 inches ply on all sides and now it is 1.5" thick and really very heavy. Its finished with designer wood laminate. I do not trust the polish guys any more as I could not find a good painter who could polish it as per my expectation.

Here is the finished speaker.





Here are the pictures during the initial built showing the inside cuts.










While I was working on this design I read about the Altec drivers and got interested as I wanted to have some high sensitivity drivers and was passionate for the big drivers. For years I have been listening to full rangers from fostex and Lowther and have always dreamt of owning big drivers.
I again decided on a challenging design. I opted for design based on Altec 620cabs but thought of giving the outer look similar to Tannoys flagship speakers (Royal Kingdom)

I feel I have been fairly successful in copying the looks, I have used a dummy driver at the bottom similar to one in the Royal Kingdom. These cabinets are not finished yet as some paint/polish work is required. I expect to have them finished in next 2 weeks time. Here is how it looks.



I have listened the Altec 604-8G 16" and Tannoy HPD 385 15" in this cabinets and they both sound good. There are lot of tweaking options in the crossovers for both and I will do that once its moved my dedicated room

Here are detailed pictures of the built









I invite all members who want to listen to them. Just reach out to me and I will accommodate you. Weekends are preferred. Some of the forum members have already listened to the Tannoy Monitor Golds with my Luxman and Airtight 300B and were appreciative of the sound this combination produced.

--Vinay Arora

 

[grubyhalo]

Fantastic!

 

[anilva]

I have heard Tannoy Monitor Gold 15" in a Westminster cabinet and Altec 604s as well. They both exhibit their distinctive sound signatures. I prefer both and will keep both and not one vs. the other.

Cheers.

 

[Rajiv]

Hi,

Your speakers look great.:clapping: Your filling the empty spaces with sand(?) in the GRF cabinets is a great idea.

The Tannoys and Altecs are both great speakers albeit with their own sound signatures. As Anil said I would keep them all.

As to which speaker to use with the Air Tight 300b amp ,my choice would be the Altec 604G.

In my experience the Tannoy Monitor Golds need a little more power and an amp that can control the woofers .The Monitor Gold woofers use a heavier cone. The Monitor Golds should sound great with the Luxman. Give the Golds 15 watts of clean power and they sing. Also the Golds sound very good with solid state amps as they were designed to work with them.

On the other hand the Tannoy Monitor Reds use a lighter cone and are slightly more sensitive.They are also 16 ohms. Try them out with the Air Tight . Try connecting them to the 8 ohm speaker tap on the Air Tight.You will lose a little power but get better damping of the woofer and tighter bass.

Since you also have the 12 inch Reds you could try them out in the RGRF cabinet.It is a matter of swapping drivers as the Reds and Golds use the same frames.

You can tweek Tannoy crossovers,but leave the inductors alone.You can change the capacitors and resistors but the inductors are specifically designed for the Tannoys(the DCR values are very critical to the voicing) and messing with them is not recomended.

For the Altec I would strongly recomend Jeff Markwarts crossover. I have built his crossover for my 605A speakers and it is far better than the stock Altec crossover.

Jeff Markwart's Corner - Phase Corrected Crossovers

The Altec 604G will work very well with the Altec 620 cabinet,but you have modified it to use a passive radiator ((dummy driver).I am not sure how this affects the tuning of the cabinet and the sound? Below is a link to another variation of the 620 cabinet.

Billforts Audio Obsession

Both the Altecs and Tannoys work well in cabinets with wide baffles.(at least 24 inches).Put them in a narrow baffle and they sound thin and lose a lot of the midrange magic they are famous for.

Regards
Rajiv

 

[rud3dawg]

Amazing work Cybervinay!!! Especially the detailing on the replication of the Tonnoy RKs pretty sweet I must say

Kudos!!!:clapping:

 

[avidyarthy]

Anyone from South Delhi visiting Vinay at Dwarka .... GIMME A LIFT TOO! Keen to have a look at his DIY stuff ..... serious!

 

[Gerry_the_Merry]

Absolutely awesome, buddy. 3rd August a must. Just make sure you have them all ready to be hooked up.

 

[prem]

Hi Cybervinay, both the speakers look awesome. I am sure they sound great too. After taking so much pains to build them why do you want to discard one of them?

 

[santhosh]

Hi Vinay,
I was eagerly awaiting your thread with pics. Very nice builds both. Thanks for sharing. I need to plan a trip to Delhi/NCR soon hyeah:

I too voted for the Altecs with the Airtight as the 300B will be more than ample power to drive the high-efficiency Altecs. With the Tannoys, though they are ~92dB sensitive, they require more than 10 watts to sing.

For the Altec I would strongly recomend Jeff Markwarts crossover. I have built his crossover for my 605A speakers and it is far better than the stock Altec crossover.

Jeff Markwart's Corner - Phase Corrected Crossovers

Rajiv, I think Vinay is using mast_mutter's autotransformer. Vinay, please confirm.

 

[cybervinay]

Hi,

Your speakers look great.:clapping: Your filling the empty spaces with sand(?) in the GRF cabinets is a great idea.

The Tannoys and Altecs are both great speakers albeit with their own sound signatures. As Anil said I would keep them all.

As to which speaker to use with the Air Tight 300b amp ,my choice would be the Altec 604G.

In my experience the Tannoy Monitor Golds need a little more power and an amp that can control the woofers .The Monitor Gold woofers use a heavier cone. The Monitor Golds should sound great with the Luxman. Give the Golds 15 watts of clean power and they sing. Also the Golds sound very good with solid state amps as they were designed to work with them.

On the other hand the Tannoy Monitor Reds use a lighter cone and are slightly more sensitive.They are also 16 ohms. Try them out with the Air Tight . Try connecting them to the 8 ohm speaker tap on the Air Tight.You will lose a little power but get better damping of the woofer and tighter bass.

Since you also have the 12 inch Reds you could try them out in the RGRF cabinet.It is a matter of swapping drivers as the Reds and Golds use the same frames.

You can tweek Tannoy crossovers,but leave the inductors alone.You can change the capacitors and resistors but the inductors are specifically designed for the Tannoys(the DCR values are very critical to the voicing) and messing with them is not recomended.

For the Altec I would strongly recomend Jeff Markwarts crossover. I have built his crossover for my 605A speakers and it is far better than the stock Altec crossover.

Jeff Markwart's Corner - Phase Corrected Crossovers

The Altec 604G will work very well with the Altec 620 cabinet,but you have modified it to use a passive radiator ((dummy driver).I am not sure how this affects the tuning of the cabinet and the sound? Below is a link to another variation of the 620 cabinet.

Billforts Audio Obsession

Both the Altecs and Tannoys work well in cabinets with wide baffles.(at least 24 inches).Put them in a narrow baffle and they sound thin and lose a lot of the midrange magic they are famous for.

Regards
Rajiv

Rajiv, All your observations and opinions are correct. During my research as well I have concluded the same. I did try the Monitor Reds in this cabinet with my 2A3 but it was a mismatch due to the impedance mismatch. Even if if it works well the 300B there will always be a doubt in mind regarding this mismatch. Reds will fetch a decent money on ebay. My golds are are in much nicer condition (absulutely mint) compared to reds.

I have heard Tannoy Monitor Gold 15" in a Westminster cabinet and Altec 604s as well. They both exhibit their distinctive sound signatures. I prefer both and will keep both and not one vs. the other.

Cheers.

Hi Cybervinay, both the speakers look awesome. I am sure they sound great too. After taking so much pains to build them why do you want to discard one of them?

Anil and Prem,
I would love to keep both but what do you do if you have on offer your dream combination and don't have sufficient funds. I am building my complete setup arounf airtight to have better synergy. Considering Airtight ATC-1 which comes with the phono and Airtight ATE-2 which is a phono with line stage

Anyone from South Delhi visiting Vinay at Dwarka .... GIMME A LIFT TOO! Keen to have a look at his DIY stuff ..... serious!

Avidyarthy, your visit is long due. You are welcome any time.

Hi Vinay,
I was eagerly awaiting your thread with pics. Very nice builds both. Thanks for sharing. I need to plan a trip to Delhi/NCR soon hyeah:

I too voted for the Altecs with the Airtight as the 300B will be more than ample power to drive the high-efficiency Altecs. With the Tannoys, though they are ~92dB sensitive, they require more than 10 watts to sing.

Rajiv, I think Vinay is using mast_mutter's autotransformer. Vinay, please confirm.

Santosh, Yes I am currently using complete crossover from Mast_mutter's. I know Jeff Markwarts crossover is good but I read mast_mutter's is more musical and have decided to go with my heart than mind.

 

[prem]

Hi Cybervinay


If thats the case go with Altec. Tannoy IMO needs a little more power.

 

[ashishkesarwani]

I have been fortunate enough to hear Vinay's DIY efforts and was very pleased with the end results. I really liked the combo with the Luxman Amp, but his room is too small to really bring out the best from them.
My best wishes and luck are always with Vinay and would praise the efforts. :clapping:

 

[malvai]

I have been fortunate enough to hear Vinay's DIY efforts and was very pleased with the end results. I really liked the combo with the Luxman Amp, but his room is too small to really bring out the best from them.
My best wishes and luck are always with Vinay and would praise the efforts. :clapping:

I agree with you word for word...

and I really can't see how he will fit the Gigantic Altec's that he has built, in that room....

the speakers - both the Tannoy & the Altec are brilliantly built. but a enormous overkill for the room.

(Don't take anything i have mentioned the wrong way Vinay.)

 

[cybervinay]

I have been fortunate enough to hear Vinay's DIY efforts and was very pleased with the end results. I really liked the combo with the Luxman Amp, but his room is too small to really bring out the best from them.
My best wishes and luck are always with Vinay and would praise the efforts. :clapping:

I agree with you word for word...

and I really can't see how he will fit the Gigantic Altec's that he has built, in that room....

the speakers - both the Tannoy & the Altec are brilliantly built. but a enormous overkill for the room.

(Don't take anything i have mentioned the wrong way Vinay.)

Ashish & Manav

I agree with you to some extent. I have been listening to my Fostex based horns for couple of years and dry laidback sound from non-horn speakers was no go for me and I wanted to experience sound from these big speakers.

I have done some dampening and twekes this weekend and base boom that was these is no more and bass range is not overshadowing the mid frequencies. The speakers were any way sounding better with the Airtight compared to the Luxman SS

My logic is something that can work in big room should also be sufficient for a small room. I am contnuing my DIY efforts to better the sound that suits me.

May be some day if I get bored with this sound may come back and build another small speaker which all of us will like.

--Vinay Arora

 

[Rajiv]

Hi,

and I really can't see how he will fit the Gigantic Altec's that he has built, in that room....

the speakers - both the Tannoy & the Altec are brilliantly built. but a enormous overkill for the room.

The big Altec and Tannoy speakers can and will sound very good in a small room.

May be some day if I get bored with this sound may come back and build another small speaker which all of us will like.

Once you have heard the Altec and Tannoy sound there is no going back to small speakers.

Vinay,with the Tannoys and Altecs I found that if the speakers are positioned in a way that the tweeter/horn axis cross just in front of your listening position, say about a foot or less in front of your normal seated head position the soundstage and imaging improves a lot. (experiment with speaker position) The HF of both the Tannoy(dual concentric) and Altec(duplex) is directional so if the tweeter/horn axis cross too far in front you lose a little HF detail .

Regards
Rajiv

 

[AMITNOIDA]

Hi,

The big Altec and Tannoy speakers can and will sound very good in a small room.

It is true. I was fortunate to listen to Rajiv's big Altec driver speakers in his small room and they sounded fabulous.

Regards
Amit

 

[santhosh]

Guys,
IMO the Altecs 604 in a 620 cabinet is not too big for Vinay's room. Unlike other speakers, it is the tone and timber that people look for in Altecs and even Tannoys to some extent. This is not to say that they don't image well. Come to think of it, even my room is small but I don't think I can ever go back to listening to small speakers again

 

[Rajiv]

Hi,

IMO the Altecs 604 in a 620 cabinet is not too big for Vinay's room.

Santosh,you are correct but Vinay has modified and added a passive radiator(dummy driver) to the cabinet.I am not sure what this does to the tuning/sound. Passive radiators not tuned right will blur bass definition.

This is not to say that they don't image well.

The Tannoy dual concentric and Altec Duplex drivers are famed for their imaging,because of their point source design.

Regards
Rajiv

 

[santhosh]

Hi,



Santosh,you are correct but Vinay has modified and added a passive radiator(dummy driver) to the cabinet.I am not sure what this does to the tuning/sound. Passive radiators not tuned right will blur bass definition.




The Tannoy dual concentric and Altec Duplex drivers are famed for their imaging,because of their point source design.

Regards
Rajiv

Absolutely agree Rajiv.

Vinay, you should consider taking out that additional driver and making a new baffle (if possible). I have found even having another pair of speakers in the same room affect the sound.

 

[ashishkesarwani]

I have found even having another pair of speakers in the same room affect the sound.

The best way to control the Negative effects of another speaker in the same room is by shorting the +ve and -ve terminals when they are not in use.