Gruby goes DIY, atlast! <WARNING! Long, meandering & boring ramble ahead!>

[square_wave]

For you -

A horn build with an amplifier of the SET or First Watt Variety. Keep the speaker large and the watts preciously small.

 

[grubyhalo]

For you -

A horn build with an amplifier of the SET or First Watt Variety. Keep the speaker large and the watts preciously small.

I haven't come across many that could be made to work in a tiny room, unless you mean a horn loaded HF? Rajiv's set up works really good in his room, which is not too big. I think he's using a BLH for the woofer. I'd prefer to keep it a bit smaller than that if I could. Do you have any recommendations that I could look into?

 

[square_wave]

@ Gruby,

You said dynamics matter and you like to rock. Horn loaded speakers do this better than any. The horn guys ( Rajiv and Santhosh) are the right guys to speak to. I am sure there are designs that will work in smaller rooms too. 14 x 12 is not exactly small. I know folks who run quite large speakers in these kinda rooms. Right placement/designs will work wonders.

 

[grubyhalo]

Thanks !

 

[Hiten]

If subjective opinion without any listening experience is allowed I would like to recommend following amplifiers.
1) Pass F5 (Clean Class A power designed by the master, do check if you have access to this amp for the heat issue. I think it is not that much which is made out to be. Not sure)
2) For Digital - Ice Power Modules (Teac has one reference model A-H01 with such modules and good quality DAC thrown in too.)
3) Gainclones by Peter Daniel (Class AB, reputed to sound nice.)
4) Current Yamaha A-sXXXX amps (Which I believe runs for first few good watts in class a,)
I think you will not regret a nice little vfm turntable with built in preamp in a corner of your room to listen to pre digital era recordings not available on CDs.
Regards

 

[apk]

I haven't come across many that could be made to work in a tiny room, unless you mean a horn loaded HF? Rajiv's set up works really good in his room, which is not too big. I think he's using a BLH for the woofer. I'd prefer to keep it a bit smaller than that if I could. Do you have any recommendations that I could look into?

Hi,
When I visited Viren of Lyrita Audio a couple of months ago, he was working on a couple of designs for horn loaded speakers. He mentioned that one of the designs is meant to work in small rooms. You could phone up Viren and have a chat with him regarding horn designs for smaller rooms.

Best,
APK

 

[grubyhalo]

Hi,
When I visited Viren of Lyrita Audio a couple of months ago, he was working on a couple of designs for horn loaded speakers. He mentioned that one of the designs is meant to work in small rooms. You could phone up Viren and have a chat with him regarding horn designs for smaller rooms.

Best,
APK

I will look into it further, thanks!

 

[grubyhalo]

After quite a bit of reading and hair-splitting that my job affords me , the possible candidates for the speaker design seem to fall into the following 3 categories:

High Sensitivity (>96dB sensitivity)

SEOS Dayton-12 Kit (?dB, 28hz - 20khz, Approx. BOM:$600)

Medium Sensitivity (86-95dB sensitivity)

Continuum MLTL (86.95dB, ~40 - 22kHz, Approx. BOM:$350)
ER18 MTM (?dB,?, Approx. BOM:$610)
ER18 MTM - Ribbon (?dB,?, Approx. BOM:$680)
Peerless NOMEX 164 (~90dB,~40 - 20kHz, Approx. BOM:$?)
GR Research N3 (~90dB,~40 - 20kHz, Approx. BOM:$520)

Low Sensitivity (<86dB sensitivity)

Continuum (84dB, 65 - 22kHz, Approx. BOM:$350)
Invictus (83dB, ~30 - 20kHz, Approx. BOM:$926)

The following are the pre-amps and amps under consideration currently.

Pre-amp

Dodd Audio Battery buffer
DC Coupled B1
Salas 6V6
Aikido Octal All-in-one
Arjen Helder tube pre

Amp

Firstwatt F4
Firstwatt F5
Arjen Helder Tripath TA2020
Moskido
Class D Audio SDS-254/258
Ref. C
SYMEF

I am also interested in seeing what comes out of the discussion on this thread. If a design is finalised and board designed around the TI TPA3100D2 (same as the TBI Millenia), I would be tempted no-end to try one. SET(?) sound in a compact, cooler, cheaper and more powerful package does sound like the bees knees to me.

Ofcourse, all this may have to wait till a decision is made on the speakers.

DAC

Twisted Pear Buffalo II/III + IVY III
Twisted Pear Opus + IVY III

Please feel free to point out any other suggested designs I may have overlooked.

 

[kroyin]

I can give you my opinion about RevC & F5 (speakers,preamp, dac) all being same
I will always turn on the F5 first (but ReVC is there, it has it good points, just that F5 is more engaging).RevC is parts sensitive ,mine has the goodies (Elma Silmics,Caddoks the works). If you want to avoid class a this is a good option


For nomex it will cost you sub 50k depending on how you are sourcing parts (mine was hand delivered in bits & pieces)

 

[grubyhalo]

I can give you my opinion about RevC & F5 (speakers,preamp, dac) all being same
I will always turn on the F5 first (but ReVC is there, it has it good points, just that F5 is more engaging).RevC is parts sensitive ,mine has the goodies (Elma Silmics,Caddoks the works). If you want to avoid class a this is a good option


For nomex it will cost you sub 50k depending on how you are sourcing parts (mine was hand delivered in bits & pieces)

Thanks. I am trying to see if some of the bits could be carried personally and the rest shipped, although I am bracing myself for the worst-case scenario for now...

 

[kroyin]

If you balance your pre power (60k) budget and class D is your poison then look no further than the Hypex Ncore

 

[grubyhalo]

Ah. I knew I forgot something! Yes, the nCore does appear quite attractive. Maybe if I could skip a pre AND need a lot of wattage, nCore might just be the ticket. Thanks!

 

[doors666]

After quite a bit of reading and hair-splitting that my job affords me , the possible candidates for the speaker design seem to fall into the following 3 categories:

High Sensitivity (>96dB sensitivity)

SEOS Dayton-12 Kit (?dB, 28hz - 20khz, Approx. BOM:$600)

Medium Sensitivity (86-95dB sensitivity)

Continuum MLTL (86.95dB, ~40 - 22kHz, Approx. BOM:$350)
ER18 MTM (?dB,?, Approx. BOM:$610)
ER18 MTM - Ribbon (?dB,?, Approx. BOM:$680)
Peerless NOMEX 164 (~90dB,~40 - 20kHz, Approx. BOM:$?)
GR Research N3 (~90dB,~40 - 20kHz, Approx. BOM:$520)

Low Sensitivity (<86dB sensitivity)

Continuum (84dB, 65 - 22kHz, Approx. BOM:$350)
Invictus (83dB, ~30 - 20kHz, Approx. BOM:$926)

Invictus looks yummy. though I think you will exceed the budget unless some one carries the drivers for you. dont worry about the sensitivity, pick speakers first and then you can pick a matching amp, unless of course you've set your heart on some SET amp. i would skip the n3, the woofer isnt in the same league. continuums have a killer crossover with good drivers. er18mtm will give you that presence that others cant.

The following are the pre-amps and amps under consideration currently.

Pre-amp

Dodd Audio Battery buffer
DC Coupled B1
Salas 6V6
Aikido Octal All-in-one
Arjen Helder tube pre

why not build some simple cathode follower, you can add/tweak/roll much more with this. no shortage of cheap tubes on ebay. that is half the fun of diy, mucking around with things. I am looking forward to it.

Amp

Firstwatt F4
Firstwatt F5
Arjen Helder Tripath TA2020
Moskido
Class D Audio SDS-254/258
Ref. C
SYMEF

wow, those choices are all over the place. little power, high power, class a, chipamp, class d. You need to select the speakers first, that will give you clarity on selecting a pre and amp. not much of a point in having an aikido in front of a moskido. Why go for class D audio if you are going to make a high eff speakers. Pass's amps arent easy, specially when you've missed the boat on the gb, the cab and sinks will give you a lot of issues. not easy with tubes either, cutting all those precision holes for tubes, OPTs are also not that easy to come by i believe.

I am also interested in seeing what comes out of the discussion on this thread. If a design is finalised and board designed around the TI TPA3100D2 (same as the TBI Millenia), I would be tempted no-end to try one. SET(?) sound in a compact, cooler, cheaper and more powerful package does sound like the bees knees to me.

Ofcourse, all this may have to wait till a decision is made on the speakers.

Damn, and I just wrote a bunch of lines above on this

DAC

Twisted Pear Buffalo II/III + IVY III
Twisted Pear Opus + IVY III

Please feel free to point out any other suggested designs I may have overlooked.

buffalo 3 is supposed to be better among these two. did you manage to find any comparisons between the buffalo 3 and the ODAC.
Why not use a tube for the dac ivy stage.

 

[grubyhalo]

...unless of course you've set your heart on some SET amp. i would skip the n3, the woofer isnt in the same league. continuums have a killer crossover with good drivers. er18mtm will give you that presence that others cant.

I do love the SET sound but am not sure if it would be my first choice.

...why not build some simple cathode follower, you can add/tweak/roll much more with this. no shortage of cheap tubes on ebay. that is half the fun of diy, mucking around with things. I am looking forward to it.

I do intend to start mucking about different designs sometime in the future. However, to start with, I might be getting help to put everything together. It's not true DIY, I know, but still...

...not much of a point in having an aikido in front of a moskido. Why go for class D audio if you are going to make a high eff speakers. Pass's amps arent easy, specially when you've missed the boat on the gb, the cab and sinks will give you a lot of issues. not easy with tubes either, cutting all those precision holes for tubes, OPTs are also not that easy to come by i believe.

Well, that was my initial thought as well, but the designer of the Moskido insists that an Aikido-Moskido combination works quite well. However, if I decide on a Moskido, I intend to drive it through the Salas 6V6.

...buffalo 3 is supposed to be better among these two. did you manage to find any comparisons between the buffalo 3 and the ODAC.
Why not use a tube for the dac ivy stage.

That is my understanding as well. Though the ODAC seems quite the champ, it does not do DSD nor 192KHz, which I think I need. I also believe that the ESS9018 used in the Buffalos is a better DAC than the ESS9023 used in the ODAC...

 

[jetlag]

Hi Gruby
I agree with Kroyin. Hypex NCore is great ( I have the 180st which is great as well). You may need a Grounded Grid Pre( I hear Gobble has one..) to mate it with Class D though.

Peace
Jetlag

 

[captrajesh]

I thought I'll suggest N Core but refrained considering your budget. There was a lead time of 18 weeks when I ordered. As luck would have it, when my order materialised, Rupee went to all time low & I got pissed & decided to peel off. If you are interested, I can check if the order is still valid & pass it on if so.

 

[jetlag]

@Sachin
GB on tube pre, hmmm good idea

 

[grubyhalo]

Hi Gruby
I agree with Kroyin. Hypex NCore is great ( I have the 180st which is great as well). You may need a Grounded Grid Pre( I hear Gobble has one..) to mate it with Class D though.

Peace
Jetlag

GG is another option I may consider if I really do need a pre. In case the speaker design I decide on needs an amp as powerful as the nCore, I may look at driving it straight from source and skip the pre. That's one of the reasons I am considering the IVY III I/V stage for the Buffalo since it is also a line-stage. The volume control for the DAC would be digital and directly on the DAC chip itself.

I thought I'll suggest N Core but refrained considering your budget. There was a lead time of 18 weeks when I ordered. As luck would have it, when my order materialised, Rupee went to all time low & I got pissed & decided to peel off. If you are interested, I can check if the order is still valid & pass it on if so.

Hey captain, you are right, that would definitely bust my budget. I would consider it only if I decide to skip the pre. Thanks for the offer on the nCore order but I am not ready yet for it.

Thanks all for your pointers!

 

[doors666]

if you are planning to go for invictus, there's a GB going on for tweeter ld25x - Creative Sound Solutions: CSS LD25X - Page 2 - diyAudio

contact hasaudio.co.nz on diyaudio, he was offering a discount on 8531 woofers some time ago.

 

[sachu888]

@Sachin
GB on tube pre, hmmm good idea

Suggest any good design

Regards,
Sachin