Power cords

[sidvee]

of course since i have some background in power distribution i dont take that literally but each component does add /subtract power characteristic which affecgs the local loop.

I am a power novice - and I pretty much believe and go by what I hear - and I hear positive and negative impact of power cables. Don't really care if it is placebo effect, or neighbors envy:lol: or whatchamcalit but if i can hear it then - to me - it is true.
Specifically I use Shunyata diamondbacks on source and pre-amp components and feel that major sonic impact can be felt here.
cheers,
Sid

 

[digitalv]

I've read through the entire article and I'm afraid it conveniently misses a few basics.

Fact-1: A thicker guage and low reactance power conductor is capable of delivering faster current transients than a thinner cable... No doubt about it... it is basic electronics/electrical theory.

FACT-2: A power cable is just a medium to deliver power...It does not have generation or buffering capability.

Current Transient Capability of Premium Power Cables: A premium cable is indeed capable of passing on faster current transients...We will agree with the demonstration as proven by graphs and makes complete sense since it has lower reactance and better conduction properties.

But so what! If the preceding cable sections straight from the road-side transformer to EB aluminium wiring, to meter, to CB to internal copper wiring to the wall socket is of relatively inferior transient current capability and NOT able to deliver as fast as the glorified cable can pass through, it simply defeats the purpose of having a glorified cable in the last few feet. The glorified cable cannot deliver what it doesn't receive in fist place... it is just a faster medium with no generation or buffer capability.

The current transient delivering capability is not just dependent on the glorified cable, but it depends on the entire length of wire from road side transformer to your power supply unit.

Its akin to a simple mechanical chain where the weakest link (poorest conductor here) determines the final current transient response...

Also in many modern designs, the current transients are purposefully slowed down to reduce the EMI noise. The article conveniently forgets that as well.

The article also does not dwelve into how a slow transient or a fast transient capability affect the audio output.

PS: The function of DTCD can easily be mimicked by a fast voltage probe and a current probe connected into a medium resolution oscilloscope. The beauty of DTCD may eventually lie if the whole combo can be made significantly cheaper and it could very well be achievable.

Please feel free to post counter opinions...No offence intended or taken.

 

[sidvee]

Actually I cannot comment on the technical aspects of the article either for or against - as I am not qualified. My only comments will be based on what I stated in my previous post - personal experience, in my own room and system - I have experienced substantial improvements using shunyata cables against stock cords and cords from other mfrs. specifically in source and preamp. sections. My second comment is more general in nature. I have seen a lot of people spend considerable money on power cords, not only the rich audiophools:lol:, but people who enjoy and love music and are themselves qualified musicians. Obviously they are hearing something better from upgrading - you cannot fool all of the people all of the time - and from reading the Shunyata article above - it is obvious that not all power cable mfrs. are snake oil salesmen. They have proper facilities, invest in testing and over and above that are themselves very well qualified in the field.
Cheers,
Sid

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

you cannot fool all of the people all of the time

But you can fool millions for centuries quite easily. Marketing has been going on for a very, very long time, and is very, very successful.

As for "qualified musicians," I know some who are perfectly happy listening to a tenth-generation cassette copy, in which I can barely hear rhythm, and can not hear melody. Musicians are able to use some other content in the sound information they receive that I cannot detect at all!

And, anyway, just because they are musicians does not mean that they are not subject to the same placebo effects, the same misunderstandings, and the same marketing tricks as the rest of us!

On a more general note, I used to trust my ears. I even thought quite highly of their ability to rate sound quality. Since joining this forum, only, I have been caused to further research why I might not be hearing what I'm hearing!

 

[sidvee]

But you can fool millions for centuries quite easily. Marketing has been going on for a very, very long time, and is very, very successful.

As for "qualified musicians," I know some who are perfectly happy listening to a tenth-generation cassette copy, in which I can barely hear rhythm, and can not hear melody. Musicians are able to use some other content in the sound information they receive that I cannot detect at all!

And, anyway, just because they are musicians does not mean that they are not subject to the same placebo effects, the same misunderstandings, and the same marketing tricks as the rest of us!

On a more general note, I used to trust my ears. I even thought quite highly of their ability to rate sound quality. Since joining this forum, only, I have been caused to further research why I might not be hearing what I'm hearing!

Pardon if I go OT - so which field does not have marketing - where the people go and buy the product out of the goodness of their hearts:lol:. Why single out audio? and if audio consumers are getting fooled by this marketing spiel - that includes state of the art manufacturing and testing BTW - then God help everyone else. Everything we buy or consume is bogus, all our senses are being totally fooled - We are living in the Matrix - not the real world.
Cheers,
Sid

 

[arj]

Pardon if I go OT - so which field does not have marketing - where the people go and buy the product out of the goodness of their hearts:lol:. Why single out audio? and if audio consumers are getting fooled by this marketing spiel - that includes state of the art manufacturing and testing BTW - then God help everyone else. Everything we buy or consume is bogus, all our senses are being totally fooled - We are living in the Matrix - not the real world.
Cheers,
Sid

LOL continuing OT..I know there are advertisement industry wizards here who can confirm...but when we buy a coke or a pepsi, i believe we are paying 50% of the cost in order for them to get a celebrity to tell us it is good

ie Basically we pay more to pepsi/coke so they can pay a celebrity to tell us to pay for pepsi coke.

 

[Hiten]

OK have taken a tiny little break from listening to vinyls. So back again .
Brothers, Most of the arguments and counter arguments are done before. Probably hundreds of times across all the forums. So an audition is due.

Going back to listening to vinyl. (Just got Kraftwerk Autobahn. 20 mins of synth. elec. pop . Sounds OK. But not quite like man machine and Trans Europe Express)
Regards

 

[sidvee]

Brothers, Most of the arguments and counter arguments are done before. Regards

I concur with you Hiten - we seem to be a little late on HFV catching up:lol:. And none of these were ever conclusive and IMO will never be. Skeptics will be - well skeptics and power cord consumers will be - well power cord consumers and the twain shall never meet.
Cheers,
Sid

 

[sidvee]

LOL continuing OT..I know there are advertisement industry wizards here who can confirm...but when we buy a coke or a pepsi, i believe we are paying 50% of the cost in order for them to get a celebrity to tell us it is good

ie Basically we pay more to pepsi/coke so they can pay a celebrity to tell us to pay for pepsi coke.

Thankfully we don't have a famous celebrity trying to sell powercords then:clapping:. All I can remember in Stereophile a few years ago, a nude woman had cables wrapped around in strategic points - and the caption was something witty. Fortunately I did not let my eyes fool me, I listened to my ears and did not buy those cables.
Cheers,
Sid

 

[arj]

Thankfully we don't have a famous celebrity trying to sell powercords then:clapping:. All I can remember in Stereophile a few years ago, a nude woman had cables wrapped around in strategic points - and the caption was something witty. Fortunately I did not let my eyes fool me, I listened to my ears and did not buy those cables.
Cheers,
Sid

I remember..I believe there was even a letter to stereophile apparently which said- forget the cable , but is the woman available ?

 

[arj]

I concur with you Hiten - we seem to be a little late on HFV catching up:lol:. And none of these were ever conclusive and IMO will never be. Skeptics will be - well skeptics and power cord consumers will be - well power cord consumers and the twain shall never meet.
Cheers,
Sid

Exactly..believe in what you want to believe in..(and what your ears tell you). people are not going to change opinions even after "auditions".
only thing is be true to yourself ie if you dont hear a difference, dont pretend you do and vice versa..in the end you are only fooling yourself either way !

 

[sidvee]

I remember..I believe there was even a letter to stereophile apparently which said- forget the cable , but is the woman available ?

:lol:, but coming back to the topic at hand - and it reminds me of another thread on USB cables - I notice a trend in these threads where an expert or one who claims knowledge or a skeptic basically says (actually trashes is the right word) that another person who has experienced some improved audio reproduction due to some tweak is just fooling himself, and that no difference exists. This is the part I strongly disagree with. Even more so when that person spends time, money and effort trying to improve the sound - he is doing it because he believes and hears it working. He is not pontificating some theoretical improvement which may or may not be scientifically sound, he is actually acting on what he believes - and that IMO is laudable and that is what this hobby is all about.
Will end it with a quote:
Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence (I think Carl Sagan quoted this)
Cheers,
Sid

 

[Rajiv]

Hi,

Since joining this forum, only, I have been caused to further research why I might not be hearing what I'm hearing!

Regards
Rajiv

 

[deepakgang]

Sid - Please can you let me know availability of your cable in India

 

[sidvee]

Sid - Please can you let me know availability of your cable in India

deepakgang - if you are referring to the shunayata's AFAIK there is no shunyata dealer in India. I picked up a 20 amp venom in Singapore earlier this year. The Singapore dealer is willing to ship to India though.
Another place to source these is on A'gon, but you have to pull the trigger quick on these as they seem to be a very popular cable.
Cheers,
Sid

 

[Hiten]

Friends,
It is given that 'what one hears is what one should believe in'. But doesn't this hobby also mean sharing views/thoughts/experiences. Skeptics should loosen their rigid stance and believers should not see it as a confronting that they are made to prove that power cords make a difference. Easiest way is to get together and listen properly. I have a feeling both parties would have some new things to think about.
Regards

 

[hifiashok]

Friends,
It is given that 'what one hears is what one should believe in'. But doesn't this hobby also mean sharing views/thoughts/experiences. Skeptics should loosen their rigid stance and believers should not see it as a confronting that they are made to prove that power cords make a difference. Easiest way is to get together and listen properly. I have a feeling both parties would have some new things to think about.
Regards

i wudn't mind even paying for being part of such a well conducted, unprejudiced session, other than assisting & contributing.

 

[jls001]

- we seem to be a little late on HFV catching up:lol:. And none of these were ever conclusive and IMO will never be. Skeptics will be - well skeptics and power cord consumers will be - well power cord consumers and the twain shall never meet.
Cheers,
Sid

Existential questions bear repeating, much discussing and constant chronicling lest we forget them in the humdrum of our diurnal (and nocturnal) existences.

 

[hifiashok]

a lot of us may b plain ignorant (or green), (and/or) want to be able to experience and decide for ourselves rather than necessarily fall in line with one of the two camps on hearsay/reading-up. the suggested session does not necessarily need to have the same set of protagonists as all previous, though the model definitely should draw from the past so as not to repeat mistakes that have already been made.

like i suggested, it is possible this specific group hits on the answer that has been 'elusive'/'inconclusive' for so long despite multiple efforts!!

 

[awedeophile]

I will be happy to invite all parties up North for a session of Music accompanied with some nice Malts and/or Wine. Bring your cables - Finolex, Shunyata, Transparent, DIY or whatever! If you can hear a difference, great.. If not, enjoy the malt, music, crisp cold weather and company (hopefully )! Cheers!