Power cords

[ajay124]

These days I am researching power cord options on the internet.As usual the luxury of actually auditioning them is not available in our Tricity trying to become a metro city
I have read a little about the usual suspects,Wattgate,Furutech,Oyaide for connectors and XLO,Kimber,Cardas,Siltech,Supra etc.for the cables.Looking for more information about the relative merits of Rhodium,Gold,Siver and Copper connectors.Most people seem to prefer rhodium or gold if budget is not a constraint.Silver and copper seem to be better conductors than gold but they corrode with time,leading to degradation.Copper corrosion leads to formation of cupric acid whch is non conductive.The general opinion is that the metal of the male connector should be the same as the metal used in the power receptacle.Mating different metals may lead to resistance and electrolytic corrosion.Eagerly awaiting expert comments on conductivity,corrosion and 'cross' mating
I want to keep the cable length very short (one & a half feet) as the power sockets are directly behind my audio rack.Cables should be shielded and fitted with heat shrink tubing at both ends.I would prefer connectors which have American 5 amp male plugs for the cdp and pre and 15 amp UK plug for the power amp.Are the European Schuko plugs better than the UK plugs which are supposed to be less efficient because they have a fuse? Should US power cords rated for 125V be considered for use in India?

 

[captrajesh]

Silver and copper seem to be better conductors than gold but they corrode with time,leading to degradation.Copper corrosion leads to formation of cupric acid whch is non conductive.

AFAIK, the upper layers of Copper and Silver being in contact with air, react with the oxygen in the air and oxidise to form Cupric and Silver oxide; the result is lesser conductivity.

 

[digitalv]

I can understand the benefits of EMI shielding on power power cables to prevent 50Hz hum induction into "analog" input signals, but expecting anything more from an expensive power cable vs any generic good quality AC power cable/interconnect is as effective as a voodoo doll to me. Let the discussions begin....

 

[venkatcr]

Discussion on HDMI cables moved to http://www.hifivision.com/audio-video-cables/17055-hdmi-cables-how-they-work.html.

Please continue discussions there.

Cheers

 

[cmsajith]

What about the cables upto the power socket from the meter board..are they shielded and short in length? Hope you might have got the answer..

 

[ajay124]

Thanks venkatcr!

When I began this thread I only had power cords for two channel hifi in mind.I am specifically looking for advise and information related to various brands of connectors and power cables for my cdp,pre amp and power amp.I am convinced that replacing my generic cables with good connectors and cables will substantially improve audio quality.Many hifi brands may be scams and snake oil but there is a plenty of good stuff out there.Can power cords REALLY make a difference?Can one really hear the difference with a properly matched and set up source,amp,speakers and cables?

I believe it is essential to have a good ear in order to be able to 'hear' a difference.And the only way to develop a good ear is to regularly listen to diverse genres of innovative music for several years.A good ear may be inborn to some extent, but it needs to be honed and polished by constantly listening to music.There are no short cuts or substitutes.A good ear CANNOT be acquired by primarily listening to amps,sources,speakers and cables with little regard or knowledge of the music being played.The hardware is merely a path to arrive at the destination.And the destination will always be music.Many budding and even seasoned audiophiles ignore or do not spend enough time listening to music.They focus their energies on listening to their hardware instead.A path which will inevitably lead into a no man's land of far fetched and incredible theories and discussions.Storms in a tea cup.Rising and subsiding.Leaving not a trace when they are gone.

 

[ajay124]

What about the cables upto the power socket from the meter board..are they shielded and short in length? Hope you might have got the answer..

Unfortunately the cable from the main board is not shielded and is very long in length.It runs externally from a gallery outside the house to the living room.The length from the main board would be roughly 45 meters as the full 90 meter roll spliced into two cables for phase and neutral,was consumed.Cable used is 4mm Havell.The electrician came on a Sunday and this was the only acceptable cable available.I had wanted to use a LAPP cable which at roughly 4000 inr,is twice as expensive as Havell or Finolex.An earthing cable was also installed.Cables were covered with batons for aesthetic reasons.

I have not gone into the EMI/RF filtering capabilities of the online UPS,but even if there is filtering at the source,the cables would again pick up interference during the long external run.I tried putting the UPS in the same room as the hifi but that was a total fiasco.Are there any sheilded cables available in India?What would they cost for a 90 meter roll?

For the power cords to be efective I feel it is essential to have a reasonably constant and pure power supply from the main board.I am looking for power cords which can add more resolution,detail,depth,sweetness and air to the SQ. A quote attributed to Barbara Striesand "I don't want much.I just want more."

 

[sidvee]

I am looking for power cords which can add more resolution,detail,depth,sweetness and air to the SQ. A quote attributed to Barbara Striesand "I don't want much.I just want more."

I have had good luck with Shunyata, specifically with diamondback and am currently using these with source and preamplification. They are relatively, reasonably priced - I think $275 for a 1m. I am also generally impressed with Audio Art power 1 cables and am using these for my amplification needs. Again these are fairly reasonable as well in the $200 range. Down the road I am considering upgrading these to the shunyata python line as well.
Anyways my belief is that power cord performance is well into the realm of subjective interpretation, so one has to be able to listen before making a decision.
Cheers
Sid

 

[arj]

hey Ajay, while the effect of quality power is a lot more scientific/explainable and good power is always good, powerchords are a bit more of Magic
I have generally preferred copper, although silver, gold and rhodium coating etc do add their own "Signature". although subtle..they do impact.

regarding powerchords, effect can vary across components and across systems so you will never get a consistent reponse from anyone. Overall the source is where the impact is Maximum, followed by the pre and then the Amp.

practically Schuko is the best connect especially because it is rated at 230V while US is actually at 115V, Although what should matter is the current rating, which is usually higher in US plugs. if you are going to re-terminate your own chords then the Shuko is the best option. But personally, since i did buy a few after market chords and the availability of Schuko vs US is almost 1:20 i have standardized on the US plugs .

I dont like UK plugs for precisely the point you noted...the fuse is in the plug and usually not a great quality. since there is a fuse in teh equipment anyway, this becomes redundant ! from my limited experience , typically all chords have a signature....and the most practical powerchord is a Finolex 4mmsq cable braided and terminated with a good connector (Copper/Brass)

I am standardizing on the Furutech FI11 for all cables where i have a control since i find them good and effective and Oyaide is too expensive . Wattgate is the next best option in terms of VFM.
but the best person to speak to on Powerchords and connectors in Dr Bass...he has experimented the most on this area !

 

[captrajesh]

powerchords are a bit more of Magic

typically all chords have a signature

As I understand, the first quoted statement seems to imply that Power chord is a lot of snake oil but the second seems to suggest otherwise.

Could you elaborate on the magic thing?

the best person to speak to on Powerchords and connectors in Dr Bass...he has experimented the most on this area !

I'm looking forward.

 

[dinyaar]

These days I am researching power cord options on the internet.As usual the luxury of actually auditioning them is not available in our Tricity trying to become a metro city
I have read a little about the usual suspects,Wattgate,Furutech,Oyaide for connectors and XLO,Kimber,Cardas,Siltech,Supra etc.for the cables.Looking for more information about the relative merits of Rhodium,Gold,Siver and Copper connectors.Most people seem to prefer rhodium or gold if budget is not a constraint.Silver and copper seem to be better conductors than gold but they corrode with time,leading to degradation.Copper corrosion leads to formation of cupric acid whch is non conductive.The general opinion is that the metal of the male connector should be the same as the metal used in the power receptacle.Mating different metals may lead to resistance and electrolytic corrosion.Eagerly awaiting expert comments on conductivity,corrosion and 'cross' mating
I want to keep the cable length very short (one & a half feet) as the power sockets are directly behind my audio rack.Cables should be shielded and fitted with heat shrink tubing at both ends.I would prefer connectors which have American 5 amp male plugs for the cdp and pre and 15 amp UK plug for the power amp.Are the European Schuko plugs better than the UK plugs which are supposed to be less efficient because they have a fuse? Should US power cords rated for 125V be considered for use in India?

Hi Ajay
Well back to this controversial topic!!

In my experience EVERY power cable I inject into my set up CHANGES something. One should go into this ONLY if one can try it in ones set up else this is going to be a waste of money.

A well made cable + connector is great but in SOME cases even this will not lead to any sonic benefits.

Any plating on the contacts is to prevent corrosion and frankly I dont have that keen a ear to tell the differences the different platings have on the sonics. I have IEC plugs from the basic 320 I Wattgates to the cryo treated Oyaides and the recently acquired Furutech s from Shridhar. They are all good. Just depends HOW FAR u are really planning to go on this!!! Prices of the Oyaide / Furutech are many times the wattgate.

Power cables vary greatly in construction/ choice of metals/ shielding. Some cables work well with source equip, some with low powered gear (small amps / preamps) and some with big power amps. I know loads of guys will say all this or most of it is snake oil so best to try before U buy.

Now most Cos (VDH, Kimber etc etc) claim U must buy a certain length of cable for the cable to actively FILTER. Generally its about 1.5 meters or 6 ft. I dont buy this theory. But I also would not advise U to have cables that are just a foot & a half as u mentioned. Some of these cords are very rigid and difficult to work with and a meter is the safe minimum to have.

Choosing US or UK sockets is a personal matter. I prefer the UK 3 pin plugs to the US type. Unless ur wall sockets too are US/ UK type it defeats the purpose to an extent and U are better off saving some money and buying yourself 16 A or 25 A Northwest 3 pin plugs. Also remember a US pre terminated power cable is wired differently so one has to invert the PHASE / NEUTRAL at the wall socket. Schuko wont get earthing in our conventional Indian Wall sockets so that is a concern on gear with 3 pin male IECs as that means the component requires earth.


Lastly regarding the use of the US made power cables on 230V :-
I was always a bit worried about this too but have used them extensively (XLO , Kimber ) and have had no issues at all. In fact Kimber is supposed to be optimised to 110 V!!!

If I may advise u a cable for a Bryston pre / power it would have to be the Kimber PK 14 and PK 10 with basic Wattgate connectors. In my opinion U will get a BETTER BALANCE and a smoother HF response while an XLO will make your ears bleed!!! Some guys claim the connector matters more than the cable itself. I cant buy that theory as the AC is carried by the conductors in the cable so I cannot understand where they are coming from. I agree that a poor connector (tons around) will be a bottleneck.

Rgds

Cables I own are XLO , Cardas, VDH , Supra but have experimented with most of the popular choices in the last few years.

 

[square_wave]

Like Dinyaar correctly noted, power cables are a hit and miss with various gear. In a revealing setup, any change in the power cord will change something in the sound. Whether the change is good or not is for the listener to decide. Non shielded or shielded for power cords is another controversial issue. I know some very experienced audiophiles who have moved completely into non shielded but braided cables. They swear by them but there are many others who prefer shielded. Again all this depends on your gear and also your listening preferences. There is no magic bullet !

 

[ajay124]

arj
Can you explain the Finolex 4mm power cord option in a simple manner?What connectors male and female would you use with them?Does one simply take two equal 4mm lengths,one for phase and one for neutral,twist them around each other and fix male/female plugs.Should one add a cable for earthing?

 

[gobble]

Great post Dinyaar! Very informative. I have a DIY 4sqmm finolex braided at home pending a suitable power plug and good quality IEC socket. I found this pricelist for Northwest :north-west switches and sockets

The prices are in INR so wondering where in India they are available? And where do I get good quality IEC sockets in India? I checked on S.P road and didn't find any "audiophile" or decent grade and finish, just cheap looking ones.

--G

 

[arj]

Ajay. i have 3 equal finolex cables braided together. you could potentially choose any other cable for earthing..it will not matter.

I have a set with wattgates on both ends and another with with Furutechs on both....on my amp they are hard to tell apart. although you can note some increased clarity when used on my transport.

I still am not able to replace my ESP reference on my transport as it provides a uch more transparent sound and more details with clearer bass and treble.

i use thefollowing cables..
Transport : ESp reference
DAC : Yamamura millennium
Amp: Ecossed Big red with Furutech
Phonostage : Finolex.
AC regenerator : Finolex
Turntable: Finolex.

I do have a VH audio flavor 4 pair which i plan to use on my Subs...i currently have them in Einstein cables which are also pretty good and affordable.

As I understand, the first quoted statement seems to imply that Power chord is a lot of snake oil but the second seems to suggest otherwise.

Could you elaborate on the magic thing?

hi Captrajesh,
there are cords which are snake oil but i think a lot more people take the powercord much more seriously today than earlier. what I meant to imply is the same as what Dinyaar mentioned.... unpredictable and with an unexplainable X factor !

eg the cable I use on my source may be better on your amp...or sometimes may not just work on your system !!!

to be honest i have not really understood any science around cables..in the end it is all about the materials used, conductor configuration, the insulation used and the termination..but they do make a difference (Damn them !)

 

[ajay124]

dinyaar,arj
Both of you have highlighted the X factor.X as in unknown.I too feel that a power cord cannot be bought 'blind',because the X factor will only come to light after an audition.I recently had that experience when I used a Volex power cord with the Arcam.The change was so dramatic that both my wife and I felt we were listening to a different system.My wife working on a computer in an another room,unaware that I had changed the power cord,almost immediately noticed the change and mentioned that the music was sounding different.
I bought the cdp,speakers,amps and cables without an audition,but I would prefer to audition the power cords and buy them one at a time.First for the cdp,then the pre and finally the 4B SST.

 

[murali_n]

Hi all,

I had replaced the stock power cords with a braided LAPP make cable(German make) 1.5sq.mm and I discovered that the background sound is very dark on my Marantz CD 5003 CDP .:clapping:

N.Murali

 

[arj]

ajay, the Finolex is worth a gamble as all you need is a good connector pair at both ends..only problem is 50% of the Finolex are apparently fakes :sad: so you need to get it from a really reputed place (yes, the difference between a fake and the original is pretty apparent)

 

[ajay124]

arj
I have some left over Havell 4 mm cable.Can I take two lengths of one meter each,and braid them together along with an earthing cable?Should the earthing cable also be 4mm?Can I use a Crabtree 5 amp male plug at one end?Which IEC connector is easily available in the market?
murali_n
The LAPP cable was recommended to me by somebody who is manufacturing Servo stabilizers.His opinion was that Lapp is far superior to Havell or Finolex.Where did you buy it from?Is it available in short lengths?How much did it cost you per cable?Would it be possible for you to make one and ship it to me.

 

[arj]

Sure it will work. i dont think the earthing is that critical in terms of size but i guess size is not a -ve there. ...but if you braid 1m you will get slightly more than 1/2 a meter of completed cable !!! and you need 2-5 cms on each side for the termination..so plan bigger
IECs available should be Elcom... they work
I have bought stuff from RS electronics in the past...not audiophile stuff but good for trials..if they work get the Wattgates /furutech/oyaide

although now when i see their prices are up .. you can contact Sridhar for connectors..its worthwhile to have a couple of pairs around.