tubes for beginner

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doors666

doors666

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this thread is probably a bit premature as i still have a few pending projects and it will take a few months before i can get to it, still want to start atleast the research. I am looking to get something tubey just to get some exposure. I have heard tube setups here and there for very short durations only.

Few key requirements:

1. diy only. dont want to spend a bomb on this. No expensive tubes please. PCB will be good, but dont mind doing p2p if the ckt is simple. Will probably use some kind of perf board in that case.
2. low voltage only. Is there an inherent disadvantage in going with low voltage tubes. Dont want to deal with high voltages or output transformers.
3. buffer/hp amp only. no power amps at this stage. hp amp should not be very restricted in terms of what impedance loads it can drive. Aikido and heretical look like two good candidates for buffers.
4. Dont want sugar coated stuff. just looking to add a bit of warmth and take away some harshness. BTW, is 'sugar coatedness' a property of the design or the tube itself.

All of you tube gurus, how did you start your tube journey.
 
Here are a few options I think you should research before pulling the trigger:

MKIV Universal Pre-amp Uses all double triode 9 pins valves! 14~30V input | eBay

Aikido LV

The Aikido has a very good reputation among the DIY crowd. Also, the manuals for all their pres are available for download, which would give you an idea of what you are in for. You could also take a look at their long list of line-stages and see if there is anything else that could possibly suit your needs. Among the Aikidos the Octals are supposed to have the best SQ followed by the others, but apparently the difference is not night and day. As I understand, there is a version of Aikido for pretty much any tube type you could think of. Another advantage of the Broskie kits is that most of them have the PS built into the same board as the line-stage.

GlassWare Line Stage & Headphone Amplifiers Kits and PCBs

Here's another popular, albeit slightly expensive option:

Transcendent Sound Grounded Grid Preamp

This one may not be for a starter but it's most intriguing from what I've read with a lot of positive reviews vis-a-vis premium manufacturers. Maybe this would make a good second build option for you?

6V6 line preamp - diyAudio


P.S: I did not quite read your post properly on the first pass, so some of the info I have put out may not be applicable to you. You may want to note that the Aikido is NOT a buffer but a pre whose gain can be modified based on the type of tube you select. However, Broskie also has a few designs on sale that are buffers and you should be able to see them in the page that I have linked to. Here's another tube-buffer option that has quite a few fans:

DODD AUDIO - DIY

The following would be my choice for the headphone amps. The first one, I think, is a re-work/modded version of the amp that ranjeetrain had linked to on eBay.

A Super-Simple 6DJ8 Headphone Amp

The Compact Tube Hybrid Amplifier

There may be a GB for the boards for the CTH here:

the CTH (Compact Tube Hybrid) Rev A thread...
 
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bottlehead quickie, aikidos, heretical, salas 6v6 preamp, compactron, some headwise and diyaudioprojects listings etc are all on my to be investigated list. GG is quite expensive, but beaten by aikidos in the sq dept at a fraction of the cost, atleast as per posts on diya.

I liked aikido LV, but the gain is an issue. I would prefer a buffer. The ACF is a buffer which can be used with the 6dj8 etc low voltage tubes also, making it a low voltage no gain option. Its not advertized in the low voltage config, but the documentation for acf states that 6dj8 can be used.

If my understanding is correct, you need gain if your source isnt upto par in terms of signal level, i dont think any of my sources are like that.

Recently read that even the heretical has low voltage options, actually it seems thats where it started.

Will check out the rest.
 
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Tubes, sound different and warmer as compared to the conventional solid state circuit. Most tube amps and pre amps are based on high votage circuits, don't attempt unless you are very sure.
Best bet, as posted by few of the members here is to build a headphone amplifier.
Most of the circuits use a dual triode tube (12au 7s or 12ax7s), that way you can use one tube for both the channels. It also involves a mosfet or a transistor stage to match the impedance with that of your headphones.
Easy for a beginner :)
you can find a few circuits on www.diyprojects.com :)
 
My first tube project Tetra Sans Ps Phono Preamp.

tetrax.jpg



tubex.jpg



tubeh.jpg




rifag.jpg
 
Grubby halo has given some great suggestion.

Cavallili audio EHHA rev A and aikido are some great headphone amplifiers. I have the former. You can check some more on head fi.
 
Tube preamp will tame some of the harshness for sure. The Grounded Grid is highly recommended. I heard it in my setup wit he nad325 powering the speakers, it was snappy, exciting, alive and sizzling.

Tube warmth is a comment thrown about loosely but in practice many tube kits can sound lean or neutral.

The best sound - if your speakers are compatible with - will come from a tube power section.

--G
 
gobble said:
Tube warmth is a comment thrown about loosely but in practice many tube kits can sound lean or neutral.

The best sound - if your speakers are compatible with - will come from a tube power section.

--G
Click to expand...

Thats what i am not able to figure out. there are quite a few comments about some of the stuff saying its neutral like ss. then whats the point, i might as well go with ss. most of my stuff is quite neutral. i would like to have some tubey option that i can take out if i feel like. idea is to take out some harshness, add a bit of warmth for some of the genres (like jazz, classical, but not for rock or metal, so for that, i will take it out), dont want that excessively sugar coated sound though. Or get a hp amp (yet to get decent headphones, using porta pro right now), i already have o2 in progress, so will have both ss and tube hp amp. or a buffer, can take it out if i want, dont need it for imp matching etc as the sources are fine.

dont have hef speakers for set amps. some day might go for pp though, but thats a long way away.

keith_correa said:
>>>>>>>>>>This<<<<<<<<<<<<
Click to expand...

I saw that one from the diyaudioprojects site, real cheap, some 36$, very tempting.
i like your avatar, ghost who walks, have quite a few comics, best super hero ever, what legendary history.

grubyhalo said:
Just to clarify, the Salas 6V6 can be set-up as a buffer as well...
Click to expand...

didnt know that. no low voltage option though i think, could be wrong, that thread is huge and i am yet to go through the whole thing.

For low voltage tubes like 6dj8 or ecc88 etc, what are some of the good and cheap tube sources. dont want to get exotic versions of these. do i need to get matched ones. 10% tolerance good enough?
 
doors666 said:
Thats what i am not able to figure out. there are quite a few comments about some of the stuff saying its neutral like ss. then whats the point, i might as well go with ss. most of my stuff is quite neutral. i would like to have some tubey option that i can take out if i feel like. idea is to take out some harshness, add a bit of warmth for some of the genres (like jazz, classical, but not for rock or metal, so for that, i will take it out), dont want that excessively sugar coated sound though. Or get a hp amp (yet to get decent headphones, using porta pro right now), i already have o2 in progress, so will have both ss and tube hp amp. or a buffer, can take it out if i want, dont need it for imp matching etc as the sources are fine...
Click to expand...

This may not help much in taking you closer to what you're looking for but just thought I'll share it all the same. I would not want to go for tubes just hoping to get a tube-y/warm sound from my system. I have listened to a few tube setups (not a whole lot) but failed to identify the tube-y part of the sound. To me, the ones I heard sounded more 'real'. I wish I knew enough to explain this better. If you are infact looking to get a warm-sounding setup, you may want to consider a DIY Pass F4, driven by an Aikido, which by all accounts is a warm yet detailed SS amp. The other important reason I would be interested in a tube setup is because the no. of parts used would be less (from what little I understand) than a comparable SS setup. This would mean, easier maintenance and troubleshooting.

doors666 said:
...dont have hef speakers for set amps. some day might go for pp though, but thats a long way away...
Click to expand...

What kind of speakers do you have? Any reason why you do not want to consider a pre instead of a buffer?

doors666 said:
...For low voltage tubes like 6dj8 or ecc88 etc, what are some of the good and cheap tube sources. dont want to get exotic versions of these. do i need to get matched ones. 10% tolerance good enough?
Click to expand...

You should find a lot of feedback on these tube types discussed in this thread, unfortunately I did not bookmark the exact posts.

A Very Compact Hybrid Amp

Here are the links for the F4, incase you get curious:

6moons audio reviews: FirstWatt F4

F4 power amplifier - diyAudio
 
grubyhalo said:
This may not help much in taking you closer to what you're looking for but just thought I'll share it all the same. I would not want to go for tubes just hoping to get a tube-y/warm sound from my system. I have listened to a few tube setups (not a whole lot) but failed to identify the tube-y part of the sound. To me, the ones I heard sounded more 'real'. I wish I knew enough to explain this better. If you are infact looking to get a warm-sounding setup, you may want to consider a DIY Pass F4, driven by an Aikido, which by all accounts is a warm yet detailed SS amp. The other important reason I would be interested in a tube setup is because the no. of parts used would be less (from what little I understand) than a comparable SS setup. This would mean, easier maintenance and troubleshooting.
Click to expand...
I am also not 100% sure what exactly i am looking for. this is basically an experiment, consider it my introduction to tubes. well, if i go for aikido, whether i get the tubey sound or not, i will get a damn good pre/buffer for a reasonable price.
What kind of speakers do you have? Any reason why you do not want to consider a pre instead of a buffer?
Click to expand...
My gain fundas are not all that clear. sources are basically going to be sound card for this (odac/essence/revolution), no need for extra gain. if i go for a pre with gain, i will have to tame it with volume control, so whats the point

You should find a lot of feedback on these tube types discussed in this thread, unfortunately I did not bookmark the exact posts.

A Very Compact Hybrid Amp

Here are the links for the F4, incase you get curious:

6moons audio reviews: FirstWatt F4

F4 power amplifier - diyAudio
Click to expand...

my amp is currently topping, probably will replace it with myref. this is desktop system. currently using b1 to switch between sound cards, once the main speakers are ready, will move b1 there.
speakers are low sensitivity. alpair 7 and continuums, so the set amps wont do.
 
Another take will be to clone yaqin cd1 tube buffer a well regarded buffer .
1.0x0.jpg


get NOS GE 5654 pair in 500Rs,custom wound trafo 200Rs i am here for r core version.
also EI trafo i can get wound as needed
,caps+ components max 900Rs


in<2k buffer must be alive
very simple schematic is here
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/tubes-valves/96681-tube-buffer-6j1-5654-6ak5.html

u can finish it while drinking evening coffee ,no pcb needed
 
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...my amp is currently topping, probably will replace it with myref. this is desktop system. currently using b1 to switch between sound cards, once the main speakers are ready, will move b1 there.
speakers are low sensitivity. alpair 7 and continuums, so the set amps wont do.
Click to expand...

Since you're amp is a Topping, you should probably just consider the Helder pre or the Yaqin buffer...
 
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