300b amps

[square_wave]

In case you are planning for a SET, here's what the Atmasphere amp designer say about the Turnburry.

" The Tannoys have been very tube-friendly. We have a lot of customers using them with our amplifiers (which also use 6AS7Gs).

The speaker is rated at 93 db and is 8 ohms. Unless you have a very small room you will want some power to drive this speaker- a good 60 watts in most rooms, perhaps even more.

To really hear what an SET does, its best to have the speaker be efficient enough such that the amp does not need to play more than about 20% of full power to play the loudest portions of the music. Otherwise the higher ordered harmonics come into play and you really don't hear what the amp is about.

This BTW is not about playing loud, its about playing clean "

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/amplifier-for-tannoy-turnberry-gr

Abhi has a reply there too from 2015.

 

[heliumflight]

Don't know where Pani disappeared. He was a true gem for the audiophile community.

 

[reignofchaos]

Thing is I have two decent 60 and 100 watt amps with me. Now the 8W 300b sounds better than both and not in a subtle way. The delta is pretty big especially in terms of flow, immediacy and palpability. Point is if this is what I am hearing, why should I bother with a push pull? End of the day, I am not going to go participate in a loudness war or suddenly develop any affinity for Western classical with huge dynamic swings. I will still be listening to rock, vocal and jazz tracks as bread and butter.

Maybe as a best case I can get a parallel 300b for extra headroom but then the cost of tubes becomes crazy.

 

[arj]

In case you are planning for a SET, here's what the Atmasphere amp designer say about the Turnburry.

" The Tannoys have been very tube-friendly. We have a lot of customers using them with our amplifiers (which also use 6AS7Gs).

The speaker is rated at 93 db and is 8 ohms. Unless you have a very small room you will want some power to drive this speaker- a good 60 watts in most rooms, perhaps even more.

To really hear what an SET does, its best to have the speaker be efficient enough such that the amp does not need to play more than about 20% of full power to play the loudest portions of the music. Otherwise the higher ordered harmonics come into play and you really don't hear what the amp is about.

This BTW is not about playing loud, its about playing clean "

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/amplifier-for-tannoy-turnberry-gr

Abhi has a reply there too from 2015.

This mirrors my experience
I have a tannoy Kensington in a 12x18 room for more than 8 years now. I can get wonderful vocals with a 20w amp. But to get dynamics scale and presence on needs at least 50w hence have a KT88 now
To coax performance out of an SET one needs preamp/phono with a higher gain to make up- something i am not comfortable as I have found it compressing dynamics. Prefer higher up in chain to be on the lower side of gain

I think Abhis 300b is different as he has a modified the driver section with a different tube

 

[square_wave]

Sacthailand makes these. I know a manufacturer who loves their products. Not very popular in the mainstream media but very popular among the underground circles. 3 to 6 months order time. No idea about price. But still just 17 watts max per monoblock. And 30 kg per monoblock.

sacthailand.com

 

[Dr.Bass]

I dont think so. Even Turnberry recommends a minimum of 20 watts. Think about it.

Your friend primarily listens to Bollywood and is willing to sacrifice bass, drive and dynamics for tone and flow. He himself says that’s a sacrifice he’s ok to.

If you are telling me you are hearing solid bass and dynamics at your place, something’s not right.

But as i said if you are willing to sacrifice bass and dynamics for tone and flow then i guess it’s ok.

The friend doesn’t feel there is any lack of dynamics actually. It is the opposite. He is yet to hear an amp which produces such realistic instantaneous dynamics. Tried Tenor OTL 75 which uses 4 6c33c per channel, Mcintosh MC275 also 75 watts, CJ, Rogue, Audio Space, Pass XA30.8 and what not. None could match the dynamics of the 300B. But that was with Wavac. They all sounded smaller and less agile. Even the 45 watts Croft amp sounds less dynamic and controlled than a simple 8 watt Lyrita. It defeats common assumptions.

Having said that when we want to pump up and listen at very high decibels and the music has a lot of bass ( e.g Stevie Ray Vaughan, EDM or even Floyd), a single 300B may feel limited. That’s when high power is needed. But then in most cases the higher powered options just don’t play music with same degree of insight and emotion. It’s a compromise. Those 20% music which Tannoy can play really well and loud but the 300B is not enough is the compromise. A parallel 300B SET in that case solves it well. Still there are times where only a 50 watter would do the job. And it goes on.

The friend tried Metallica recently on 3 good amps. Even there the 300B sounded the most musical and engaging. The other 2 sounded just hard. It could be a Tannoy issue too.

 

[Dr.Bass]

Don't know where Pani disappeared. He was a true gem for the audiophile community.

In 300B vaccum

 

[prem]

i guess we hear differently. I don’t hear dynamics or grip or transient attack in a 300 amp. The sound is nothing like what i hear live or in a studio. Anyways you and ROC like it. And that’s all that matters.

I guess that’s why there are so many different tubes and so many topologies.

Dr Bass, you have a very strong opinion of how something should sound which is in a way very good. I guess i hear a bit differently. You and i are very unlikely to agree on a sound unless its an amp that does everything like a LAMM ML2 for example

 

[Dr.Bass]

In case you are planning for a SET, here's what the Atmasphere amp designer say about the Turnburry.

" The Tannoys have been very tube-friendly. We have a lot of customers using them with our amplifiers (which also use 6AS7Gs).

The speaker is rated at 93 db and is 8 ohms. Unless you have a very small room you will want some power to drive this speaker- a good 60 watts in most rooms, perhaps even more.

To really hear what an SET does, its best to have the speaker be efficient enough such that the amp does not need to play more than about 20% of full power to play the loudest portions of the music. Otherwise the higher ordered harmonics come into play and you really don't hear what the amp is about.

This BTW is not about playing loud, its about playing clean "

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/amplifier-for-tannoy-turnberry-gr

Abhi has a reply there too from 2015.

I have read a lot of posts by Ralph (Atmasphere designer). He almost always dismisses SET in a subtle way. He knows people compare his amps to SETs for the overall purity and directness of sound. He has to defend it. He is a marketing guy (like most Americans). These days he justifies Class D is better than Class A because he makes Class D amps now. He even says class D is closest to tube sound

 

[Dr.Bass]

i guess we hear differently. I don’t hear dynamics or grip or transient attack in a 300 amp. The sound is nothing like what i hear live or in a studio. Anyways you and ROC like it. And that’s all that matters.

I guess that’s why there are so many different tubes and so many topologies.

I agree. And i havent been to a studio. But as far as what sounds more natural? I felt a good 300B/2a3 and other low powered SETs sounds more natural than the best of ATCs and most Genelecs i have heard. Of course the speakers have to work with it.

 

[prem]

i think ATC sounds very natural. Between a modern Tannoy and a modern ATC, i would always choose a ATC. It plays it the way i hear things in live. Tannoys add a lot of mid bass which doesn’t sound real to me. It’s a pleasing sound though.

 

[yogibear]

What's the configuration? Looks like there is an interstate. What is the driver tube?

Reproduction of Jack Elliano design. Capacitor coupled between 6SN7 and 300B.

Electra-Fidelity A3-500 300B monoblock amplifiers Review

I first met Tony Chipelo at the 2014 California Audio Show. He was sharing a room with Fritz Speakers and it was the best I had heard the Fritz speakers sound at a show. Electra-Fidelity is a boutique high-end audio company in Las Vegas, NV. It was founded by Tony Chipelo in 2010. In addition [...]

www.dagogo.com

 

[prem]

Dr Bass, I guess i am not as romantic as you areYou like all things romantic. Tannoy. 300 tube amp.

Even in the 300 amp, i prefer the modern iteration. You and i have had a lot of discussions last week when we were planning my next amp.

 

[Decadent_Spectre]

What an interesting thread. And what wonderful actors. Bravo.

 

[prem]

ROC, on a separate note, if you are planning to use only the WE Reissue 300, then make sure you get an amp that’s designed around it.

I was considering a 300 amp for Axiom 80 and had chats with a few designers. They were not sure the WE 300 Reissue would work in their amp.

For example Thoress said his 300 was designed around the JJ300. He said if i want to use the WE 300 Reissue, he will have to change some electrical parameters in his amp to accommodate the WE300 Reissue. But then he said i will not be able to use any other 300 tube in his amp. Because i knew Thoress well, he agreed to change the design to ensure the WE300 Reissue works well. The other two designers refused.

These days good designers wind the transformers to the the tube they plan to use in their amp. All windings and parts are optimised for the tube they use.

 

[prem]

Heliumflight, that’s how you get Dr Bass back on to the forum. You need to challenge his thoughts

 

[square_wave]

Even the 45 watts Croft amp sounds less dynamic and controlled than a simple 8 watt Lyrita. It defeats common assumptions.

Quick question. When you play at lower volumes, because of the simple design of SET, even if the power is very low, you tend to hear more of the attack, sustain and decay of the notes which makes micro dynamics sound amazing and more complete. If so, I agree.

I wish I could get the 300b SET sound in a 60 watt x 2 package but only weigh 25 kg in total Wishful thinking...I know.

 

[AP@1992]

ROC, on a separate note, if you are planning to use only the WE Reissue 300, then make sure you get an amp that’s designed around it.

I was considering a 300 amp for Axiom 80 and had chats with a few designers. They were not sure the WE 300 Reissue would work in their amp.

For example Thoress said his 300 was designed around the JJ300. He said if i want to use the WE 300 Reissue, he will have to change some electrical parameters in his amp to accommodate the WE300 Reissue. But then he said i will not be able to use any other 300 tube in his amp. Because i knew Thoress well, he agreed to change the design to ensure the WE300 Reissue works well. The other two designers refused.

These days good designers wind the transformers to the the tube they plan to use in their amp. All windings and parts are optimised for the tube they use.

@reignofchaos

Audio Lounge, London has WE 91, a SET 300b putting 20 watts (God knows how they got that wattage) with WE re-issue for sale. It's a demo piece and they were blowing it off. There is a Indian guy also at the back desk. It will fit your bill.

I heard it in May.

 

[Dr.Bass]

i think ATC sounds very natural. Between a modern Tannoy and a modern ATC, i would always choose a ATC. It plays it the way i hear things in live. Tannoys add a lot of mid bass which doesn’t sound real to me. It’s a pleasing sound though.

I have owned both ATC and Tannoy for considerable amount of time. I like them both. While ATC is tonally more neutral, it is IMO not as natural sounding as a Tannoy. Neutral and natural are different things. A nice example would be SS vs tubes. SS amps are typically more neutral than tube amps but tube amps sound more natural (generally speaking). The way a tube amp preserves and presents harmonics, the dynamic envelope, the bloom, the instrument illumination and size etc makes it feel more real. Similarly to me an ATC has a flatter response but it is a bit dry and doesnt bloom like real instruments. The inner details are missing. I only hear the external elements on it. It could be probably due to its low efficiency which loses vital information present in the first watt. The Tannoy in contrast feels more harmonic, vibrates and breathes better, presents lifesize instruments with bigger dynamics and even more important lot of micro dynamics. It just helps that it can be powered by low powered tube amps which present music with lot more insight and authenticity. An ATC with its own high power active module doesnt get me all that insight.

Dr Bass, I guess i am not as romantic as you areYou like all things romantic. Tannoy. 300 tube amp.

Even in the 300 amp, i prefer the modern iteration. You and i have had a lot of discussions last week when we were planning my next amp.

Interestingly, we discussed and heard so many clips of various amps and speakers, there was no occasion when we disagreed with each other on what sounds good or bad. When a clip sounded good we both gave a thumsup and vice versa. But I agree I listen more emotionally. Credit to Turntables, SET, Naim & Tannoy that brought in a different perspective to sound quality appreciation

 

[morerajendra5678]

How close does a single amplifier with 300B tube as a driver and 805/845 as power tube will sound to a 300B amplifier?
I personally have never heard a 300B driver tube with 805/845 tube. But it is often said that an amplifier will carry sound signature of driver tube. So I want to know how it is in reality.