Delhi the most pathatic A/V Dealership/professional place.

[venkatcr]

BTW why do people slyly when you praise these spks. As far as i can tell, beautiful music producing sets. For me even B&W couldn't bring that satisfaction.

That is part of human nature. I am better, what I have is better, what I know is more knowledgeable, my information is more accurate........

I am sure you have attended official meetings where you play with your mobile while the great VP is making a presentation. You listen to him with half an ear, and keep thinking what does this guy know? In an office you have no options but to listen to the guy.

Cheers

 

[Sumit]

Sanjay your real life experience with this business is very educating and yes its true that in the market like delhi people do tend to get after the cheaper deals and in the end they don't care from where they buy their stuff. But as Sumit has pointed out that if a store with a difference with no intentions of earning huge profit margins and with the sole aim of educating and serving a potential customer of this field then I guess that it would make a lot of difference to the present senario of this side of business in delhi.
Times have also changed and people are getting more and more educated into all these things, this could be due to the internet or forums and personal references of people who have these kind of setup at their places. Everyone loves music and its a hidden urge in everybody to realise that dream of his or her by getting a reasonably sounding system for a well laid out price but sometimes these dreams get shattered due to the lack of knowledge or experience that a customer like Sam is getting in Delhi. Take for example of Denny of Bass & Treble, he is doing a sizable business as well as by giving his personal attention he has earned a good reputation among us Audio/Video philes, but all he lack is a good demo room as well as the ready stock of goods. Thinking on these lines I don't think that Sumit's entering into this trade and representing brands which are not represented in Delhi at present would not be a bad idea.

Well Said!!

@Sanjay>Although, I think one can gain a lot from Sanjay's practical experience.
What was the name of your store and where was it located? What were the brands that you sold?

Cheers!
Thanks Sanjay.

 

[qoolss]

I read some interesting comments above. Hydra Ashok you had some valid points, but too heavy towards dealers ( i am not assuming, but are you a dealer?)

let me start with my story. I have come to india after spending almost 20 years of my life in london. During this time, i have had many visits to india and failed to understand the attitude of dealers towards customers. I was plain lucky, i had english accent and most of the time it gave me a upper hand in conversations, and they always felt compelled to give me demos with pateince (effect of foreign money) having said that, i have seen people coming to them and getting back one piece answers in return. the whole behavioural part use to bemused me. but not anymore... reason the whole culture of selling in delhi is such that they tend to dominate you unless you can show your wealth (is it due to colonial days and so much poverty or is it due to population that one has to snatch food from other to feed himself.. not actual food but i assume the meaning here) I have expereinced the road sense here which believe me drove me nuts lots of time. this is to my surprise no different to retail. Everyone try to outdo you. if you are reversing then they would not stop and let you do it, but either try to pass from back or front. the questions is why? well i guess it all comes down to behaviour of people in society. i think its purely due to population and extreme poverty we had till 1980s.

coming to this whole concept of less margin business will sell? i will be very suprised if given 5 years plan this will not be successful. why? well to start with lets look at the consumer or the buyers. there are few points which have changed from even 90s and those are:

1. Buying/spending power
2. High Salaries/income and stressfull life
3. Exposure due to internet
4. Society led buying behaviour
5. Young Generation and their need for gadgets
6. Revolution in bollywood and music
7. Night clubs/pubs bars and lounges

Looking from my perspective (this could be arguable) i would assume people will buy from a retailer which is not only knows what he is talking about, but also he gives you effective price (ofcourse after knowing your budget) and really good service if needed. Now the questions could be differenatiation among them, afterall most of the dealers behave really well with you when its buying time and they know you have the money and need to buy one.

the simplest way to answer this would be marketing.. marketing... marketing. And the best way to market is internet. Having show room and demo room is much needed, but at the same time you want to cater the low to mid segment people who can afford to pay for them.

I think future will be one stop shop for everything electronics which infact has already started, but due to poor sales techniques and companies sending less money on training their staff are at disadvantage.

go on Ashish and Sumit,, i am sure you business venture will be successful ( please no marketing here just pure sentiments as a prospective future buyer)

cheers,

swat

 

[shaileshmor]

All the guys who have posted on this string - Thank you so much ! This string couldn't hv been better timed for me as I hv just started scanning for Hifi Speaker systems and have had the chance to visit just 2 places - Sahil(JBL) International at Kalkaji and B&W at Saket. I must say Sahil was a good experience in terms of attention n information I got and B&W went just the way most of you described. One of the Sr Gentleman there promised to visit me at my house to suggest accoustics etc...even followed up with a call to visit on a particular day n time but strangely never turned up or even followed up after it.

I am closely following the recommendations here. I have a budget of 2.5 to 3 lakhs for a sound system which caters both to the Home Theatre plus Music listening experience.

Keep posting...Thanks again !

Shailesh Mor

 

[sam9s]

All the guys who have posted on this string - Thank you so much ! This string couldn't hv been better timed for me as I hv just started scanning for Hifi Speaker systems and have had the chance to visit just 2 places - Sahil(JBL) International at Kalkaji and B&W at Saket. I must say Sahil was a good experience in terms of attention n information I got and B&W went just the way most of you described. One of the Sr Gentleman there promised to visit me at my house to suggest accoustics etc...even followed up with a call to visit on a particular day n time but strangely never turned up or even followed up after it.

I am closely following the recommendations here. I have a budget of 2.5 to 3 lakhs for a sound system which caters both to the Home Theatre plus Music listening experience.

Keep posting...Thanks again !

Shailesh Mor

Welcome to HIFiVision , you budget and mine more or less are at the same level. Share some more thoughts with us, like what are you inclind to....movies or music. What kind of music/movies you like and what kind of setup you want. Is it a dedicated HT you are creating or using your bed/living room as an HT....etc etc.....

 

[venkatcr]

I think future will be one stop shop for everything electronics which infact has already started, but due to poor sales techniques and companies sending less money on training their staff are at disadvantage

The large one stop shops for electronics have been a dismal failure in the US excepting for Frys. Remember Good Guys? And, Fry's service is worse than any shop you see in India. Fry's reminds me of a smaller shop in Chennai called Mercy Electronics. You go to this shop, and you have to wait patiently for the counter person to catch your eye. You may shout and wave at him as much as you want, but he will not even look at you till he is ready to serve you. All Fry's cashiers are uneducated women from Punjab who cannot speak English properly and who look down upon you when you speak to them in Hindi. They have no idea of the product they are selling, leave alone the technical specifications. In the US and most of Europe, that is the norm. The large shopkeepers expect you to come with prior knowledge. What you do at the shop is look for the most inexpensive of the competing brands, or look for large discounts. Just try going to one of these shops, asking for help an see what happens. You will be completely ignored. I have always received more help from fellow buyers that from shop assistants.

I think we have to understand the mind set of the Indian dealers and the way we, as customers, deal with them also. Nearly 90% of the people who come into boutique shops fall into two categories: One; who come there to while away their time or ogle at expensive equipment. Two; who come there to take a demo of equipment with no intention of buying. Once they have satisfied themselves with the auditioning, they will invariably go to the place which gives them the lowest price. Over years, dealers have trained themselves to identify the person who will buy and the person who will not. Business is always two way. As you are expecting something from a shopkeeper, he is also expecting something from you. If you do not make him comfortable, why would he waste his time with you irrespective of how well you speak or how well dressed you are?

Cheers

 

[hifiashok]

I read some interesting comments above. Hydra Ashok you had some valid points, but too heavy towards dealers ( i am not assuming, but are you a dealer?)

nope, am into information security. like to consider myself as balanced, giving all sides their due, not biased. as a matter of fact i have been in the market for a sub for some time and my experiences have not been too good. my own experiences with buying parts of my system have been, for lack of a better word, pathetic. some on the forum are aware of this in pieces.

let me start with my story. I have come to india after spending almost 20 years of my life in london. During this time, i have had many visits to india and failed to understand the attitude of dealers towards customers. I was plain lucky, i had english accent and most of the time it gave me a upper hand in conversations, and they always felt compelled to give me demos with pateince (effect of foreign money) having said that, i have seen people coming to them and getting back one piece answers in return. the whole behavioural part use to bemused me. but not anymore... reason the whole culture of selling in delhi is such that they tend to dominate you unless you can show your wealth (is it due to colonial days and so much poverty or is it due to population that one has to snatch food from other to feed himself.. not actual food but i assume the meaning here) I have expereinced the road sense here which believe me drove me nuts lots of time. this is to my surprise no different to retail. Everyone try to outdo you. if you are reversing then they would not stop and let you do it, but either try to pass from back or front. the questions is why? well i guess it all comes down to behaviour of people in society. i think its purely due to population and extreme poverty we had till 1980s.

check my point on body lingo. in a thread Asit or Cranky mention something called 'power driving'.

coming to this whole concept of less margin business will sell? i will be very suprised if given 5 years plan this will not be successful. why? well to start with lets look at the consumer or the buyers. there are few points which have changed from even 90s and those are:

1. Buying/spending power
2. High Salaries/income and stressfull life
3. Exposure due to internet
4. Society led buying behaviour
5. Young Generation and their need for gadgets
6. Revolution in bollywood and music
7. Night clubs/pubs bars and lounges

Looking from my perspective (this could be arguable) i would assume people will buy from a retailer which is not only knows what he is talking about, but also he gives you effective price (ofcourse after knowing your budget) and really good service if needed. Now the questions could be differenatiation among them, afterall most of the dealers behave really well with you when its buying time and they know you have the money and need to buy one.

the simplest way to answer this would be marketing.. marketing... marketing. And the best way to market is internet. Having show room and demo room is much needed, but at the same time you want to cater the low to mid segment people who can afford to pay for them.

I think future will be one stop shop for everything electronics which infact has already started, but due to poor sales techniques and companies sending less money on training their staff are at disadvantage.

will mean more cost passed on to the customer, go back to where we started. in a country like india where labour is cheap, one will add to quality/cost where the quantity/cheaper guys will always remain. chicken 'n egg, vicious circle.

go on Ashish and Sumit,, i am sure you business venture will be successful ( please no marketing here just pure sentiments as a prospective future buyer)

i feel virenji's model is the best for this subject. and, he did try his hand at the showroom model (virenji, trust you don't mind my speaking of you). work from home more as a hobby/passion, arrange comfortable, convenient demos, give excellent advice and service with no expectations (well, almost none) and sale WILL happen, the good word WILL spread. all at interestingly low overheads. had a similar model in mind, thinking along Ashish and Sumit's lines, but my own experiences made me choose otherwise. the bee may be still buzzing in my bonnet.

cheers,

swat

 

[hifiashok]

All the guys who have posted on this string - Thank you so much ! This string couldn't hv been better timed for me as I hv just started scanning for Hifi Speaker systems and have had the chance to visit just 2 places - Sahil(JBL) International at Kalkaji and B&W at Saket. I must say Sahil was a good experience in terms of attention n information I got and B&W went just the way most of you described. One of the Sr Gentleman there promised to visit me at my house to suggest accoustics etc...even followed up with a call to visit on a particular day n time but strangely never turned up or even followed up after it.

I am closely following the recommendations here. I have a budget of 2.5 to 3 lakhs for a sound system which caters both to the Home Theatre plus Music listening experience.

Keep posting...Thanks again !

Shailesh Mor

i'm certain you have found threads on the forum on virenji/LyritaAudio's Amitys? do give them a hear.

 

[shaileshmor]

Hi Sam...Here are the details...

My needs are based on both movie and music.
The setup is a Lounge area which is attached to a Main living room thru an open partition. Sizes of both the living n lounge is 18ft (long) * 13ft(wide) so combined open area to which this sound system will cater to is 18 ft(long) * 26 ft(wide).

Lounge area is mainly our day to day entertainment area but when we throw parties....the whole living cum lounge will become entertainment area.

I am very universal in my music choice and prefer the details on instruments coming thru the system rather than loud noise. Balance sound therefore vs heavy bass or treble wud be my listening preference. Even though i listen to all kind of music...easy listening would be my most preferred mode.

I hv been thru Infinity and B&W demos

Infinity was Classica series C 336 Floor standing with a combo of cc225 centre speaker n C255ES Surround speakers. Since this was my first demo i was not in a position to compare but it did sound pretty good to me. He played the music on Harmon Kardon AV355 7.1 Channel...It looks like a good one too.

B&W...was decent too as it was soft on the ears...something they emphasize while selling all the time

Ready to explore more...Target date for acquiring the system is Jan end. Also more importantly ....i wud want to work on accoustics tips to ensure the setup is as accoustic friendly as possible in a general lounge n living setup.

TC...Shailesh

 

[ranojoy]

Great! Another person who felt the goose bumbs and the hair standing on end feeling on hearing the Wharfedales for the first time. So all you people who smile slyly when they hear me praising the Wharfedales, can now quickly gulp your smiles.

Cheers

well i dont know about other people, but i sure as hell got goose bumps when i replaced my jamo e430s with the wharfe 9.5s.
no sly smile on my face, i can assure you ...

 

[srinisundar]

Hi Sam...Here are the details...

My needs are based on both movie and music.
The setup is a Lounge area which is attached to a Main living room thru an open partition. Sizes of both the living n lounge is 18ft (long) * 13ft(wide) so combined open area to which this sound system will cater to is 18 ft(long) * 26 ft(wide).

Lounge area is mainly our day to day entertainment area but when we throw parties....the whole living cum lounge will become entertainment area.

I am very universal in my music choice and prefer the details on instruments coming thru the system rather than loud noise. Balance sound therefore vs heavy bass or treble wud be my listening preference. Even though i listen to all kind of music...easy listening would be my most preferred mode.

I hv been thru Infinity and B&W demos

Infinity was Classica series C 336 Floor standing with a combo of cc225 centre speaker n C255ES Surround speakers. Since this was my first demo i was not in a position to compare but it did sound pretty good to me. He played the music on Harmon Kardon AV355 7.1 Channel...It looks like a good one too.

B&W...was decent too as it was soft on the ears...something they emphasize while selling all the time

Ready to explore more...Target date for acquiring the system is Jan end. Also more importantly ....i wud want to work on accoustics tips to ensure the setup is as accoustic friendly as possible in a general lounge n living setup.

TC...Shailesh

Hi Shailesh,

Welcome to Hifi spending spreeee.

Why cant you start an seperate thread for your requirements, so have an identity and for continuos followup

regards

 

[Sumit]

Sure you can. Call me after 7pm any day. If I don't answer, then please leave a text. I will definitely call back.

Cheers!!

Hi Sam!! I am afraid, I will have to take a rain check on our meet. Some relatives have come up and I am going to be busy. We shall keep it some other day. Sorry about this.

Cheers!!

 

[mridulgoel]

Hey Sam

Woa...!!!

Nice Work Done...

Just one correction.. The HifiZone guy is not Kejender its Tejinder...HeHe...

So...So...So...

Sorry about me being off for 10dayz...

But, as deided we will surely work out sometime in 1st week of January...

Anyways, all the AV pals, outta here...this is not a formal invitation, just an update, that 1st Week of January, 2010, Armour India Group, the group with brands like QED, Q Acoustics, Myryad, and 25 more brands, including the One Touch Home Automation...

PS :: ADMIN :: This is nothing i think that should be termed as sales or from dealer. Will post the original invitation, from the Subscribed ID only...

 

[sam9s]

Hi Sam!! I am afraid, I will have to take a rain check on our meet. Some relatives have come up and I am going to be busy. We shall keep it some other day. Sorry about this.
Cheers!!

DAMM man I was looking forward to this, infact ashish and I had finalized the trip, kinda bachelor A/V enthusiastic meet.. any way I am free till 4th except 31 n 1. Schedule any day and let me know......

 

[Sumit]

DAMM man I was looking forward to this, infact ashish and I had finalized the trip, kinda bachelor A/V enthusiastic meet.. any way I am free till 4th except 31 n 1. Schedule any day and let me know......

Yeah Sure Sam, will let you know.
Sam, You have plenty of time to decide on the equipment. I am working on a 5.1 speaker setup- for movies and music both, for you.

Cheers!!

 

[sam9s]

Sam, You have plenty of time to decide on the equipment. I am working on a 5.1 speaker setup- for movies and music both, for you.
Cheers!!

Thanks Man, For Music already decided though.......... The Warfadales 10.5.. I am in love with these speakers.....

 

[Sumit]

Thanks Man, For Music already decided though.......... The Wardfadales 10.5.. I am in love with those speakers.....

Sam: I think you are going to spend about 30k on stereo speakers and then about 70k or so for LR of HT setup. Have you considered that you can get a better speaker set for 1.25K or so> which could be great for movies and music!!! Actually, I shall let you decide when I will give you the audition.

Cheers!

 

[goldee]

yes, u guys are rite. audio scene in delhi sucks indeed. was in del a couple of weeks back and went to Jamo, morduant short stores in Delhi. CR park.

The guys at morduant short was out of a projector and i had to hear the movie without seeing it on screen..just like old school days when u stand outside cinema halls to hear the dialogs of new releases...lol. so couldnt get the real punch of a 5.1

i moved on to jamo store where the demo rooms are as small as a bathroom. so again cant get the real feel... plus these guys only have a couple of cds to play...u r in for a surprise here too.

but then i went to sight n sound to audition dali ikon6. the people were more professional and looked more patient with a decent demo room. suggest that u all MUST listen to DALI before buying anything else.

my search is still on...i am yet to audition B&W and monitor audio...any dealers in bangalore?

cheers
goldee

 

[sam9s]

yes, u guys are rite. audio scene in delhi sucks indeed. was in del a couple of weeks back and went to Jamo, morduant short stores in Delhi. CR park.

The guys at morduant short was out of a projector and i had to hear the movie without seeing it on screen..just like old school days when u stand outside cinema halls to hear the dialogs of new releases...lol. so couldnt get the real punch of a 5.1

i moved on to jamo store where the demo rooms are as small as a bathroom. so again cant get the real feel... plus these guys only have a couple of cds to play...u r in for a surprise here too.

but then i went to sight n sound to audition dali ikon6. the people were more professional and looked more patient with a decent demo room. suggest that u all MUST listen to DALI before buying anything else.

my search is still on...i am yet to audition B&W and monitor audio...any dealers in bangalore?

cheers
goldee

Yep the CR park and that Jamo store were the most pathetic of auditions I went through for which I didnt want to take names, B&W was no better. Sight and Sound was ok. couple of others just avg. Its only the Danny one "Bass n Treble" that I was satisfied with, given the fact I went to him on a Sun, which was an off day for him, and indecently that is where I found my perfect speakers as well, Warfadale 10.5 coupled with Marantz amp and CD player.
For a HT setup yes Dali Ikon 6 are the closest rival for me till now, but I dont know I have a feeling that the AAD setup at Danny's would provide me the sound I am looking for in an HT setup. I have yet to audition AADs with complete 5.1 setup. Another strong contender for 5.1 for me are the Polkaudio TSi400 fronts/TSi100 rear/CS20 center and PSW125 Sub combination.

 

[sam9s]

Sam: I think you are going to spend about 30k on stereo speakers and then about 70k or so for LR of HT setup. Have you considered that you can get a better speaker set for 1.25K or so> which could be great for movies and music!!! Actually, I shall let you decide when I will give you the audition.
Cheers!

You mean spending 1.2 to get a spk set that can be used for both movies and music??? Well as I mentioned somewhere earlier in my thread I want separate spk setup as my listening preference quite differs in both movies and music, and I doubt with such a distinct listening preference I'd get spks that can work for me both on movies and music.......