Garrard 6-400 - Restoration?

[Nitin Arora]

Hello kind people,
Although I am little far away from the project, I am quite keen to evaluate the viability of restoring an old Garrard 6-400 that my father owns and will probably carry to Mumbai in August.
I am not a very keen vinyl aficionado but I certainly appreciate analogue sound and would love to have an entry level vinyl rig for some time before I think of upgrading. My current setup is a Denon 1713 and PolkTsi 400s. I am planning to set up the rest of the system in parts.
The Garrard has been lying away in storage for some time now and my dad was able to get some sound out of it before the build in amp gave up. So now the situation is that the table works fine but would need a new plinth and probably a new cart. I would much appreciate if the pros here can advice me on the below:
1. I dont know what cart is installed on the TT but could someone please tell me if MM, MC and ceramic carts can be installed on the same TT. If so is the mount on the tone arm the only consideration
2. The TT was installed on a chepo plinth by a local electrician with an inbuilt amp and two speakers. I dont know what is inside the box but I assume that I will need to buy a phono stage given that the 1713 does not have one
3. Is there any place where I can take the TT to be serviced by a pro. Probably someone from the forum.Although I would love to do this DIY. I am quite good with a soldering iron. I know that a member here (Hiten I think) has undertaken a restoration some time back. I am quite close by so would request his help if he is available and as per his convenience.
4. And finally is it worth going about this or would it make sense to put the little money that I plan to spend on the into a new TT like the Denon DP 29F or the DP 200 USB

Will be very grateful for any inputs. Thanks

 

[Record Player]

Hey Nitin - Vinyl and TTs is nostalgia. In your case I think you must go ahead with this project restoration. I am not very technical when it comes to TTs, but believe me we have Gurus here like Reuben, Hiten, Kuruvila Jacob, Stevieboy, Malvai to name a few. Many more experts here.

For a start why dont you go ahead and download the service manual of the Garrad. A signup is required Garrard model 6-400 Owners Manual, Service Manual, Schematics, Free Download | Vinyl Engine

All the best. For the befenit of the audience and project, please post detailed photos of the turntable.

Do well. Will keep an eye on this post

 

[Nitin Arora]

Thanks Record Player. I am certainly counting on the experts to lend a helping hand (or in my case might be an arm and a leg). I actually already have that manual. I am just trying to ascertain the viability of the project. I mean I do not mind putting some money into this but I am trying to understand if this is going to be worth it afterall.

Will certainly update with progress if the project takes off.

Thanks
Nitin

 

[reubensm]

we have Gurus here like Reuben, Hiten, Kuruvila Jacob, Stevieboy, Malvai to name a few.

Its very kind of you to refer to me as "Guru". I am not in the same league as Mr. Kuruvila, Malvai, Captrajesh, Santhosh, Arjun, Joshua, Stevieboy, Hiten and others. I would like to refer to myself as a vinyl enthusiast.

 

[reubensm]

Thanks Record Player. I am certainly counting on the experts to lend a helping hand (or in my case might be an arm and a leg). I actually already have that manual. I am just trying to ascertain the viability of the project. I mean I do not mind putting some money into this but I am trying to understand if this is going to be worth it afterall.

Will certainly update with progress if the project takes off.

Thanks
Nitin

The 6-400 could be an interesting project. We are about to begin the restoration of a RC210. Garrards are worth restoring but spares may have to be sourced from abroad.

 

[Nitin Arora]

Thanks reuben. Could you please shed some light on #1 of my original post?

Many Thanks
nitin

 

[hemantwaghe]

what is your location?
many of mumabi forum members take help of Pandurang at Charni Road
PM for his number

 

[Nitin Arora]

Thanks hemant, I am at Thane. Have PM'd you.

 

[Nitin Arora]

Just wondering, any other thoughts?

 

[kuruvilajacob]

I recently got a Garrard 6.400 which was restored and put up for sale at Cochin. I don't think I have taken a picture of it.

 

[Nitin Arora]

Thank you kuruvila sir for replying. I read that you are The Man here for TTs.

If anything, could you please explain to me how the MM, MC and Ceramic carts work. I mean especially #1 of my original post. Also, any advantages of one over the other (i know this might be a long one but just a few basics)

Also if you could please tell me if there are any good carts that can be installed in this TT (entry level).

Thanks
Nitin

 

[reubensm]

Thanks reuben. Could you please shed some light on #1 of my original post?

Many Thanks
nitin

You can use ceramic carts and MM carts on your Garrard. IMO, the older garrard tonearms are not suitable for magnetic carts unless they are calibrated perfectly. They are often plagued by tracking issues when tracking at lighter tracking weights. Any standard 1/2 inch mount MM should fit the Garrard headshell. From my experience, the older garrards work best when the tracking force is 3 gms or more. If using MM carts on the older garrards, avoid using the auto return feature.

 

[Nitin Arora]

Thank you reuben. So i think the next step will be to hunt for an appropriate cart and some serious reading on calibrating the table. I guess the only reason why I am lookign for opinions is to understand if it is worth doing it or should I just go ahead a buy any of the denons that i had mentioned in my opening post.

I will probably post some pics of a spare cart that my dad has lying around for the experts to review.

Also, any budget carts that come to your mind would help.

Thanks
Nitin

 

[kuruvilajacob]

I endorse Reubens views on cart for the Garrard. It is advisable to use ceramic. But getting a good ceramic cart is more difficult than getting magnetic cartridge these days. The arm of this player is not designed for magnetic cart IMO and will perform well if paired with a old amp with ceramic phono input

 

[Nitin Arora]

Thank you for your input. But as I understand the SQ of a ceramic cart will really be no match for a MM cart. Please correct me if I am wrong. This is what I wanted to understand.

I really do not mind buying a new denon TT if that is what will yield better results.

Thanks
Nitin

 

[jls001]

I really do not mind buying a new denon TT if that is what will yield better results.

Hi Nitin,
You can go check out ProJect turntables from Nova Audion in Mahim, bang opposite Vijay Sales in LJ Road.

You can also try out the Lencos that Landmark sells in their Andheri store.

Or look for used direct drive turntables from Technics, Pioneer, Sony, etc.

In case you don't already have it, you will also need a phono preamplifier, either separately standalone, or built into your amplifier.

Budget for a good cartridge. IMHO, it makes the single largest improvement in an analog chain.

 

[lifewater]

Thank you for your input. But as I understand the SQ of a ceramic cart will really be no match for a MM cart. Please correct me if I am wrong. This is what I wanted to understand.

I really do not mind buying a new denon TT if that is what will yield better results.

Thanks
Nitin

You are wrong, the DENON DP29F is no good. If you really want a cheap plastic TT ger yourself a second hand AKAI BUSH at about Rs 2500 to 3500...... plays much better. I myself am using a GARRARD 2025 TC with ceramic cart coupled to a Sonodyne amp with ceramic cart input and can assure you that it will eat the DENON for breakfast hyeah: without even burping !!!!

Regards

Lifewater

 

[reubensm]

Plastic turntables cannot be compared to any Garrard. If you cannot find a ceramic cart, would not be a bad idea to try the older Shure carts like the M75-6. My father used the M75-6 from the early 1970s and we literally grew up listing to that cart on a SP25 Mk1. However I must mention that the SP25's tonearm was balanced with a counter-weight and he used a tracking force of 1.5gm. Many of the older Garrard tonearms are spring balanced. The minimum possible workable tracking force with spring balanced Garrard tonearms is around 3 gms.

 

[Hiten]

Are yaar, there are no gurus or different leagues etc. as mentioned in earliar posts. We learn from each other.
Nitin
As for Garrard 6400. It is worth restoring only if you are sentimentally attached to it. This was a low fi fully automatic turntable. Care should be taken while dismantling the tonearm section. It has numbers of settings for tonearm movement, cueing and speed at which it drops on vinyl. Delicate springs are used for bias setting. I had number of photographs but have deleted it. The link below has few of them which may help.you
http://www.hifivision.com/phono-turntables/30595-garrard-6400-restoration.html
If analogue sound is what you are after, then you should get entry level turntable with MM cartridge as mentioned by other fellow members.
My internet is not working from last 10 days so posting from friends pc.
Regards

 

[kuruvilajacob]

IMO it is not worth restoring the Garrard if you really want to go for a MM cart with it. The best would be any decent TT from among Pioneer, Sony, Technics or other Japanese ones in good condition.If you have a budget in mind, i can suggest some models for you