Purchased Sony x9000H , what to check on delivery

Wharfedale Linton Heritage Speakers

waris

Active Member
Joined
Jul 17, 2020
Messages
346
Points
28
Location
Ahmedabad,Gujarat
Better audio and video performance. Especially audio. The difference is night and day compared to firestick. With TV you cannot enjoy lossless audio. With your set up you can very well enjoy DTS HD or Dolby tru HD with shield.
Thanks for this info. Does Netflix, Prime or any other OTT use Dolby True HD?
 

lightgamer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 28, 2020
Messages
1,128
Points
113
Location
Mumbai
Ok. Do we really need a source device since it's an Android TV? What are the advantages of say going for NVIDIA Shield PRO or Apple TV 4K?
Nvidia Shield 2019 (tube and pro) are the only android boxes that play media accurately. Firestick and basically any other media player is pretty bad when it comes to playing most media.

Here are some things that firestick 4k won't do which the others do:

Audio:
  • Doesn't passthrough DTS audio
  • No support for HD audio (no TrueHD or DTS HD).
    PS: Apple TV 4k doesn't support True HD/DTS-HD either.
Video:
  • Auto-framerate and resolution switching only works with Plex and Prime video. If you turn it on, the rest of the apps display in 1080p 60Hz.
  • Auto-framerate outputs to the TV in 8-bit only even if the content is 10-bit.
  • If you force 4k 60Hz, then the frame rate is wrong especially with 24p content and firestick upscales instead of your TV.
  • Netflix has Atmos broken since an update last year.
Also general app quality is rather bad compared to Apple TV, the chipset is a bit slow and there's no ethernet or USB port.

I'd recommend Apple TV 4k 2021 if your main concern is OTT content consumption. The interface of tvOS is the best along with app quality being exceptional. The chipset is really powerful as well leading to very smooth UX.

On the other hand, if you're looking for a local playback device, the Nvidia shield 2019 is the best there is. It supports every kind of content possible, along with the dreaded Dolby Vision profile 7 which no other device has. The only problem with the shield is that it's not officially available in India, so you either gotta import it, get it from the US or buy it in the second-hand market.
 

waris

Active Member
Joined
Jul 17, 2020
Messages
346
Points
28
Location
Ahmedabad,Gujarat
Nvidia Shield 2019 (tube and pro) are the only android boxes that play media accurately. Firestick and basically any other media player is pretty bad when it comes to playing most media.

Here are some things that firestick 4k won't do which the others do:

Audio:
  • Doesn't passthrough DTS audio
  • No support for HD audio (no TrueHD or DTS HD).
    PS: Apple TV 4k doesn't support True HD/DTS-HD either.
Video:
  • Auto-framerate and resolution switching only works with Plex and Prime video. If you turn it on, the rest of the apps display in 1080p 60Hz.
  • Auto-framerate outputs to the TV in 8-bit only even if the content is 10-bit.
  • If you force 4k 60Hz, then the frame rate is wrong especially with 24p content and firestick upscales instead of your TV.
  • Netflix has Atmos broken since an update last year.
Also general app quality is rather bad compared to Apple TV, the chipset is a bit slow and there's no ethernet or USB port.

I'd recommend Apple TV 4k 2021 if your main concern is OTT content consumption. The interface of tvOS is the best along with app quality being exceptional. The chipset is really powerful as well leading to very smooth UX.

On the other hand, if you're looking for a local playback device, the Nvidia shield 2019 is the best there is. It supports every kind of content possible, along with the dreaded Dolby Vision profile 7 which no other device has. The only problem with the shield is that it's not officially available in India, so you either gotta import it, get it from the US or buy it in the second-hand market.
My main usage is OTT . Does getting XBOX or PS5 better solution, since we get a gaming console with a Blu ray player?
I can get Shield from UAE as someone is traveling from there soon.
 

lightgamer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 28, 2020
Messages
1,128
Points
113
Location
Mumbai
My main usage is OTT . Does getting XBOX or PS5 better solution, since we get a gaming console with a Blu ray player?
I can get Shield from UAE as someone is traveling from there soon.
If you're gaming as well and are planning to use the Blu-Ray functionality they are a good option. Not sure why you would want something that costs 3x as much for basically the same or even lesser functionality. The shield/Apple TV are specialized media devices and when you really get into the weeds they are better than Xbox and PS when it comes to content consumption alone.

Honestly speaking I'm a PC user and am not sure how they will play media compared to dedicated media boxes. But I don't think they support automatic content refresh rate switching (which is very important for the motion to look right) or Dolby Vision profile 7 on digital media.

From what I can find for Series X and PS5, they're not great digital media devices as the focus is not there.
 

waris

Active Member
Joined
Jul 17, 2020
Messages
346
Points
28
Location
Ahmedabad,Gujarat
If you're gaming as well and are planning to use the Blu-Ray functionality they are a good option. Not sure why you would want something that costs 3x as much for basically the same or even lesser functionality. The shield/Apple TV are specialized media devices and when you really get into the weeds they are better than Xbox and PS when it comes to content consumption alone.

Honestly speaking I'm a PC user and am not sure how they will play media compared to dedicated media boxes. But I don't think they support automatic content refresh rate switching (which is very important for the motion to look right) or Dolby Vision profile 7 on digital media.

From what I can find for Series X and PS5, they're not great digital media devices as the focus is not there.
Ok. So Shield is better for streaming. Can we rate PQ out of 10 for
1. Firestick 4K
2. Shield
3. Blu ray player like sony S3700, UBP X700 and Panasonic BDT380
I have a 5.1 setup that will be upgraded to 5.1.2 soon.
 

lightgamer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 28, 2020
Messages
1,128
Points
113
Location
Mumbai
Ok. So Shield is better for streaming. Can we rate PQ out of 10 for
1. Firestick 4K
2. Shield
3. Blu ray player like sony S3700, UBP X700 and Panasonic BDT380
I have a 5.1 setup that will be upgraded to 5.1.2 soon.
Unfortunately, that's not how digital streamers work. If a streamer supports a codec, the PQ will be 10/10 and if it doesn't, it won't even work. This is not analogue signal where the component quality matters much.

1. Firestick 4k: It will play basic stuff. As I mentioned above, it won't bitstream HD audio (DTS, Dolby TrueHD), frame rate matching doesn't work very well, doesn't have ethernet.

As a firestick 4k user, I'd rate it 5/10 on features. It's a frustrating exercise in getting it to work on stuff.

2. Shield: Will play basically everything you throw at it. A couple of things to note:
  • It still runs android TV. So if an android TV app is badly coded or changes behaviour or doesn't expose metadata properly, it won't be able to do anything. For example, Netflix won't work with the auto refresh-rate matching as in the app it constantly changes refresh rates. You'll have to manually do that. Though this is a Google problem and android TV 12 is reportedly fixing it.
  • ExoPlayer via Plex won't work with SSA/ASS subtitles. So any alpha based subtitles streamed via Plex for example will need to be transcoded. Though you can use Kodi/VLC to fix it as those players support alpha based subtitles.
  • Not available officially in India. So you'll have to pay more + no warranty.
I'd rate it 9.5/10

3. Apple TV 4k: The best streaming box, hands down. However, it has a couple of things missing v/s shield for local playback.
  • It won't play HD audio like TrueHD/DTS-HD.
  • It won't play Dolby Vision profile 7 (dual layer)
  • No custom upscaling support like the shield. Shield has its AI upscaling which is based on Lanczos. Apple is using very basic upscaling and it doesn't support resolution matching (so will always output at one resolution unless manually changed).
I'd rate it 10/10 for streaming, 8/10 for local playback.
4. Blu-ray players: If you want to play Blu-Rays, I guess you can get them. Not sure why you'd compare them to streamers. If you don't plan to play physical media, no point getting one really.

If you want the utmost highest quality PQ for local media, nothing even comes remotely close to MadVR on PC. You can literally customize it how you want and run it via an HTPC. It's really expensive with the current GPU shortage though. One with an RTX 3060 now will cost around 1 lakh, and you need around 3060ti for the max options.
 

waris

Active Member
Joined
Jul 17, 2020
Messages
346
Points
28
Location
Ahmedabad,Gujarat
Unfortunately, that's not how digital streamers work. If a streamer supports a codec, the PQ will be 10/10 and if it doesn't, it won't even work. This is not analogue signal where the component quality matters much.

1. Firestick 4k: It will play basic stuff. As I mentioned above, it won't bitstream HD audio (DTS, Dolby TrueHD), frame rate matching doesn't work very well, doesn't have ethernet.

As a firestick 4k user, I'd rate it 5/10 on features. It's a frustrating exercise in getting it to work on stuff.

2. Shield: Will play basically everything you throw at it. A couple of things to note:
  • It still runs android TV. So if an android TV app is badly coded or changes behaviour or doesn't expose metadata properly, it won't be able to do anything. For example, Netflix won't work with the auto refresh-rate matching as in the app it constantly changes refresh rates. You'll have to manually do that. Though this is a Google problem and android TV 12 is reportedly fixing it.
  • ExoPlayer via Plex won't work with SSA/ASS subtitles. So any alpha based subtitles streamed via Plex for example will need to be transcoded. Though you can use Kodi/VLC to fix it as those players support alpha based subtitles.
  • Not available officially in India. So you'll have to pay more + no warranty.
I'd rate it 9.5/10

3. Apple TV 4k: The best streaming box, hands down. However, it has a couple of things missing v/s shield for local playback.
  • It won't play HD audio like TrueHD/DTS-HD.
  • It won't play Dolby Vision profile 7 (dual layer)
  • No custom upscaling support like the shield. Shield has its AI upscaling which is based on Lanczos. Apple is using very basic upscaling and it doesn't support resolution matching (so will always output at one resolution unless manually changed).
I'd rate it 10/10 for streaming, 8/10 for local playback.
4. Blu-ray players: If you want to play Blu-Rays, I guess you can get them. Not sure why you'd compare them to streamers. If you don't plan to play physical media, no point getting one really.

If you want the utmost highest quality PQ for local media, nothing even comes remotely close to MadVR on PC. You can literally customize it how you want and run it via an HTPC. It's really expensive with the current GPU shortage though. One with an RTX 3060 now will cost around 1 lakh, and you need around 3060ti for the max options.
Thanks for the detailed reply. Apple TV not supporting TrueHD is a bummer though . Firestick 4K has frame matching feature now though I don't know how good is it. My main grievance is Firestick playing in 1080P and Sony telling me it's 4k when pressing i+ button.
Some of the videos quality looks poor while streaming. I am never sure if I am watching in 4k or 1080P.
Coming back to the question do you think getting Apple tv ,I will be able to play DV and Atmos . If Apple tv does not support True HD and only DD+ then audio quality is same as Firestick?
 

lightgamer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 28, 2020
Messages
1,128
Points
113
Location
Mumbai
Thanks for the detailed reply. Apple TV not supporting TrueHD is a bummer though .
Apple TV does support lossless audio via ALAC though. If you use something like Infuse, it will losslessly convert any DTS-HD or TrueHD stream to ALAC or PCM and you won't lose quality.

The only downside to this is if the audio is TrueHD Atmos, you'll lose Atmos metadata.
Firestick 4K has frame matching feature now though I don't know how good is it.
As I mentioned above, the frame and resolution matching only works in prime video and Plex. Netflix, YouTube... all will max out at 1080p 60 if you enable that.

Also if you turn that on, bit depth is maxed at 8-bit.
My main grievance is Firestick playing in 1080P and Sony telling me it's 4k when pressing i+ button.
Not sure what you're talking about here. What's the display setting you're using? If you're forcing 4k 60 from Firestick, even playing 1080p will be upscaled to 4k before sending to the TV as it's supposed to.
Some of the videos quality looks poor while streaming. I am never sure if I am watching in 4k or 1080P.
This information can only be seen in the app.
Coming back to the question do you think getting Apple tv ,I will be able to play DV and Atmos .
Yes, and yes. But only the DD+ Atmos will be playable on Apple TV. TrueHD Atmos as I mentioned above won't work.
If Apple tv does not support True HD and only DD+ then audio quality is same as Firestick?
No. Apple TV supports lossless audio via ALAC and supports DTS as well.
 

rajeshpapani

Active Member
Joined
May 5, 2021
Messages
157
Points
28
Location
india
Thanks for the detailed reply. Apple TV not supporting TrueHD is a bummer though . Firestick 4K has frame matching feature now though I don't know how good is it. My main grievance is Firestick playing in 1080P and Sony telling me it's 4k when pressing i+ button.
Some of the videos quality looks poor while streaming. I am never sure if I am watching in 4k or 1080P.
Coming back to the question do you think getting Apple tv ,I will be able to play DV and Atmos . If Apple tv does not support True HD and only DD+ then audio quality is same as Firestick?
if u r telugu guy check home theatre guide channel ,he tested all media players (including zappiti,dunu )with all dts,imax,hdr formats .he reviewed many home theatre setups .
 

waris

Active Member
Joined
Jul 17, 2020
Messages
346
Points
28
Location
Ahmedabad,Gujarat
Apple TV does support lossless audio via ALAC though. If you use something like Infuse, it will losslessly convert any DTS-HD or TrueHD stream to ALAC or PCM and you won't lose quality.

The only downside to this is if the audio is TrueHD Atmos, you'll lose Atmos metadata.

As I mentioned above, the frame and resolution matching only works in prime video and Plex. Netflix, YouTube... all will max out at 1080p 60 if you enable that.

Also if you turn that on, bit depth is maxed at 8-bit.

Not sure what you're talking about here. What's the display setting you're using? If you're forcing 4k 60 from Firestick, even playing 1080p will be upscaled to 4k before sending to the TV as it's supposed to.

This information can only be seen in the app.

Yes, and yes. But only the DD+ Atmos will be playable on Apple TV. TrueHD Atmos as I mentioned above won't work.

No. Apple TV supports lossless audio via ALAC and supports DTS as well.
Thanks for clarifying my doubts. For my case I think I will plan Apple TV.
 

sandeepmohan

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 17, 2009
Messages
839
Points
93
Location
Wellington
Ok. Do we really need a source device since it's an Android TV? What are the advantages of say going for NVIDIA Shield PRO or Apple TV 4K?
You should spend some time with the TV and its built in Apps before you go and buy anything.
Granted, devices like the Shield and Apple TV can improve performance.
The question you need to answer is, what are you currently not happy about with the TV. Is the audio, video delivery poor? Spend some time, identify the flaws, research and then buy whatever media playback device you prefer. For 90% of what you do with the TV, the inbuilt apps work okay. The only real limitation is Android and the implementation with Sony can be a hit or miss. Its like the difference between the performance of a cheap android phone versus a high end one. Its more software in this case. The TV by itself is stellar.
As for lossless audio, I am not so sure what OTT (For video) service delivers lossless unless you are using services like Tidal on the TV.
I bought a UBP-X700 primarily for UHD disc play back (I work in the film field so I need this medium) and loss less HD Tracks content streamed over my home network. It has also turned out to be more responsive for Netflix and works well to stream YouTube Music from my phone (Not You Tube video). Otherwise, the app support is limited for the device.
 

ssf

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 18, 2010
Messages
1,276
Points
113
Location
Mangalore
I have a sony x900E 65" and a 4k Firestick. For the most part, the built in apps of the TV are good enough for OTT content. I watch Amazon Prime video on the FK stick though. IIRC, I must have got the 4K stick to play around with Apple Music and Tidal Atmos content. Don't really need it though.

There are ethernet/USB adaptors for Firestick if one wants wired internet or external storage.

https://www.amazon.in/Amazon-Ethernet-Adapter-Fire-Stick/dp/B01M19P4GJ
 

waris

Active Member
Joined
Jul 17, 2020
Messages
346
Points
28
Location
Ahmedabad,Gujarat
So my Testing with firestick 4k shows that Hotstar and Netflix stream in 1080P dolby vision whereas Prime Video streams in 4K HDR.
 

waris

Active Member
Joined
Jul 17, 2020
Messages
346
Points
28
Location
Ahmedabad,Gujarat
You should spend some time with the TV and its built in Apps before you go and buy anything.
Granted, devices like the Shield and Apple TV can improve performance.
The question you need to answer is, what are you currently not happy about with the TV. Is the audio, video delivery poor? Spend some time, identify the flaws, research and then buy whatever media playback device you prefer. For 90% of what you do with the TV, the inbuilt apps work okay. The only real limitation is Android and the implementation with Sony can be a hit or miss. Its like the difference between the performance of a cheap android phone versus a high end one. Its more software in this case. The TV by itself is stellar.
As for lossless audio, I am not so sure what OTT (For video) service delivers lossless unless you are using services like Tidal on the TV.
I bought a UBP-X700 primarily for UHD disc play back (I work in the film field so I need this medium) and loss less HD Tracks content streamed over my home network. It has also turned out to be more responsive for Netflix and works well to stream YouTube Music from my phone (Not You Tube video). Otherwise, the app support is limited for the device.
Sure, I will be testing the inbuilt apps. Only issue with apps with TV will be that Denon will receive audio over ARC therefore only compressed audio will be received .
 

lightgamer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 28, 2020
Messages
1,128
Points
113
Location
Mumbai
So my Testing with firestick 4k shows that Hotstar and Netflix stream in 1080P dolby vision whereas Prime Video streams in 4K HDR.
You must have put the resolution to automatic(up to 4k). That automatic resolution (and frame rate matching) only works in Prime Video and Plex. All other apps will be limited to 1080p if you select that option. If you want to stream at 4k in other apps, you'll have to select 4k 60 on firestick display settings. Now obviously frame rate won't be correct.

This is why firestick is a frustrating device to use.
 

waris

Active Member
Joined
Jul 17, 2020
Messages
346
Points
28
Location
Ahmedabad,Gujarat
You must have put the resolution to automatic(up to 4k). That automatic resolution (and frame rate matching) only works in Prime Video and Plex. All other apps will be limited to 1080p if you select that option. If you want to stream at 4k in other apps, you'll have to select 4k 60 on firestick display settings. Now obviously frame rate won't be correct.

This is why firestick is a frustrating device to use.
No, i disabled it and selected automatic resolution.
 

lightgamer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 28, 2020
Messages
1,128
Points
113
Location
Mumbai
No, i disabled it and selected automatic resolution.
That's what I'm saying. The 'automatic resolution' will work at 4k ONLY on Plex and Prime Video. It will limit you to 1080p on all other apps (Netflix, Youtube, Hotstar etc).
 
Top