Speaker suggestion's for 12' x 13' bedroom.

[venkatcr]

it is not that a floorstander is better than bookshelves - as a rule. I agree.

I don't want to get into any argument here, but for many kinds of music and specially some instruments, floor standers do provide a distinct advantage because of their capacity to push more air. You can never recreate the sound of a large drum or a cello with a bookshelf, even if you use a sub woofer.

I am talking strictly for stereo music. The rules are different for multi channel music.

Cheers

 

[SuhasG]

I don't want to get into any argument here, but for many kinds of music and specially some instruments, floor standers do provide a distinct advantage because of their capacity to push more air. You can never recreate the sound of a large drum or a cello with a bookshelf, even if you use a sub woofer.

I am talking strictly for stereo music. The rules are different for multi channel music.

Cheers

Venkat, I agree having migrated from a nice world class Book Shelf pair to a Florrstander.

But the real problem is that for a low budget of 50K or less , a Bookshef pair provides more bang for the buck. i.e. a 50K bookshelf pair is any day better than a 50K floor stander pair. To get a feel of what a well made floor stander can do one has to be in the price bracket of Rs 75 - 100K+.

 

[thevortex]

I don't want to get into any argument here, but for many kinds of music and specially some instruments, floor standers do provide a distinct advantage because of their capacity to push more air. You can never recreate the sound of a large drum or a cello with a bookshelf, even if you use a sub woofer.

I am talking strictly for stereo music. The rules are different for multi channel music.

Cheers

Not a problem at all, Venkat. As in life so in hifi - each to his own. Actually Suhas has stolen my explanation.

To the original poster here is something I would like to add. Whether one prefers bookshelves or a floorstander is down to personal preference. However for long term listening of music and for a fatigue-free experience, the .1 (the subwoofer) does not contribute. Any form of critical music listening or maybe late night listening sessions or simply when you want to listen to your favourite tracks for long hours, the subwoofer may not be your friend.

I have found out that even if the bass is less I still prefer bass to be cut out of the same cloth as the other drivers in my main speakers. This may vary with others. But just thought to share my thoughts.

 

[SAMUEL]

I would have loved to get FLoorstanders but my room dosent permit it.No space and plus my MOM wont allow me.I was thinking some bookshelf with large woofer size I guess 6.5" should be suffice.But budget is another constraint. Need to find the right balance.This system will be exclusively used only for Music. Movies I prefer watching them at theaters.(tough I do have a huge collection of movies).

Hey Biyer,
I think the best speaker for you would be the Q-Acoustics 1020i or the 1030i.
The 1020i is a book shelf speaker with 6.5" drivers and front firing bass reflex, and the 1030i is a compact tower speaker with i think the same drivers as 1020i, and can be sand loaded to tighten the bass response if you feel it's booming.
These speakers are award winning speakers so, i'm sure these won't boom as they have good internal bracing and stuffings.
And me thinks both the speakers look very beautiful and will add a great look & feel to your setup.
I think this should fit your bill perfectly.Do check with your local dealer.
Meanwhile check this out:
1020i Bookshelf/Wall Mount Speaker- 1020i
1030i Compact Floorstanding Speaker- 1030i

Best Regards,
Samuel

 

[RahulP]

Hi biyer,

Since you are considering wharfedale 9.2, am sharing this info :

Currently it is out of stock - with distributor as well as few dealers that i have interacted with. The distributor (designer audio) said anytime between 18-20 Jan., fresh stock is expected. So you can contact accordingly (Distributor also has facility for an audition)

Also, IF you want to listen to 9.2 and Tannoy F1 in the same audition session, you may want to contact Alliance4 at Andheri, Mumbai. They were having F1 about 10 days back.

regards

 

[biyer]

Hey Everyone,
Thanks a lot for all your help.

So I guess I would have to compromise a bit a go for Bookshelf.

How does the wharfedale diamond 9.1 compare to diamond 9.2?
How do they sound in a fairly small room (160 sq.feet) like mine?

What do they mean by Warm sound??I have heard this term a lot when they describe the 9.1.

ALso how do tannoy f1 custom and PSB B1/B15 compare to diamond 9.1/9.2 in terms of dynamic ability and bass response?


Doing some more research. I have tried to compare the frequency response of PSB B25 and Wharfedale diamond 9.1 Whats funny is that both have similar on-graph low frequency behavior below 60 hz yet the B25 sounded so much fuller to me while auditioning. Could this because of the room sizes?
The room i checked out PSB B25 was less that half the size of the room of 9.1 Also the 9,1 weere placed along thre width of the room(the smaller length but almost same as the room of B25)

The frequency responce of diamond 9.1
Stereophile: Wharfedale Diamond 9.1 loudspeaker

The frequency response of B25
Stereophile: PSB Image B25 loudspeaker


Am I really over doing things?

 

[venkatcr]

How does the wharfedale diamond 9.1 compare to diamond 9.2? How do they sound in a fairly small room (160 sq.feet) like mine?

If I could afford it, I would go for the 9.2. They have larger drivers and would present a larger soundstage as well as lower frequencies.

What do they mean by Warm sound??I have heard this term a lot when they describe the 9.1.

I remember having explained this before, but here it goes again. There are two types of speakers - warm and transparent. Transparent speakers do not add any colour to the sound,. They just play the sound as it is. Most American and Canadian companies make speakers that are more transparent. The issue with transparent speakers is that when you are listening to high pitched sounds such as female vocals, the sound may become uncomfortable and lead to ear fatigue.

Warm speakers on the other hand use their internal crossover electronics, and the way the drivers are made to mellow the sound and reduce high pitches to levels that are comfortable to the ears. That is why they are called warm.

Also how do tannoy f1 custom and PSB B1/B15 compare to diamond 9.1/9.2 in terms of dynamic ability and bass response?

Both the Tannoy's and the PSB Alphas are excellent speakers. I have heard the Alphas extensively over the last few weeks and they sound very nice. But as I said, being a Canadian speaker, they may sound a bit harsh when compared to the 9.2/9.1s

Doing some more research. I have tried to compare the frequency response of PSB B25 and Wharfedale diamond 9.1 Whats funny is that both have similar on-graph low frequency behavior below 60 hz yet the B25 sounded so much fuller to me while auditioning. Could this because of the room sizes?

The room i checked out PSB B25 was less that half the size of the room of 9.1 Also the 9,1 weere placed along thre width of the room(the smaller length but almost same as the room of B25)

Am I really over doing things?

Tests like the ones done by Stereophile are not done in regular rooms but what are called Anechoic chambers. This is done to completely kill any collateral sound and measure the sound coming from the speakers alone.

The speakers will sound different in real life. It may be wrong to compare the 9.1 to the B25. The B25 has larger woofer (6.5 inch) as compared to the 9.1 (5 inch). It is also a larger cabinet (217 x 403 x 305 mm) as compared to the 9.1 (236 x 145 x 165). In addition, its frequency range or width is marginally larger. It will certainly deliver 'fuller' sound as compared to the 9.1s.

You are NOT overdoing things. The more research and auditioning you do now, the happier you will be when you start using your system. You will have umpteen people coming in, listening to your system, and saying, 'I have heard better and cheaper systems.' These (subjective) statements will make you feel depressed and wonder if you have thrown your money away. On the other hand if you know very well what you are buying, you can ask such people to take a hike, and have a smile on your face.

Cheers

 

[thevortex]

As Venkat says, speaker preference is very personal. Some prefer warmth and some prefer transparency. But having owned a pair of PSB Alphas for sometime now, I can attest that they are in no way harsh. However, the ear for music differs from person to person - so one person's nectar may in fact be another's poison.

One small note though - dont even think of comparing the Image B25 with the Diamond 9.1. Even the Alpha B1 from PSB is far better than the Diamond 9.1, in my opinion. I have had extensive auditions with the Diamond 9.1 and I practically live with my Alphas

 

[afj]

Venkat, I agree having migrated from a nice world class Book Shelf pair to a Florrstander.

But the real problem is that for a low budget of 50K or less , a Bookshef pair provides more bang for the buck. i.e. a 50K bookshelf pair is any day better than a 50K floor stander pair. To get a feel of what a well made floor stander can do one has to be in the price bracket of Rs 75 - 100K+.

i second that. you may lose out on some low down bass but overall quality of music will be much better

 

[gobble]

I am kind of anti sub. I was thinking of the same option but the dealer ran out of stocks(diamond 9.2) before i could audition.This has made me reconsider the 9.1 being offered to be at a decent price.Also since my room is small I am worried about bass boom(one of the main reasons i dislike subs).
Will 9.2 be an overkill?

I have not been able to locate the dealer for MA-br2 in pune. How do they compare to the diamond 9.2's?

I got the diamond 9.2s last month and they are decent for the price - non-fatiguing for long tern listening was the major USP for me. Some people say they are not good for hard rock, but I dug out my old cd's of Lynnrd Skynrd and Cream one day (does it get harder more acid than that?) and it sounded great.

If you are not buying a sub then getting the 9.2 is important as the 9.1 and the Tannoy F1 are anemic in that area. Otherwise go for 2x 9.1s with sub. For anything like a 12x16 room and below the 9.2s or bookshelves are good. Floorstanders need an 18x18 room IMHO as the sound pressure level can be disturbing with headache giving qualities and will distract from the enjoyment of music. Ideally the 9.3 with a larger cone size would have been my first choice, but the disties do not sell it here to promote the floorstanders.

Bass boom is a matter of room acoustics. I have some good reverb and also bad reverb in my 10x12 bedroom. It is hard to absorb low freq 50 - 200hz waves without a 6 foot wide bass trap so you can forget about it. Using spikes below the speakers (with stick-on) and on the speaker stands and A/V rack will help a great deal however. The rest depends on the recording. I have some recordings that make my audio system sound really good, and others that give the bad boom - sometimes for the same instrument eg. a tabla. Depends on what frequencies dominate in a track as well.

Kosmic is a good label for example while SaReGaMa/RPG and many others can be produce bad recordings - choose you label like you choose the artist.

I suggest you wait for the 9.2s rather than pick the 9.1 in a hurry

Cheers

 

[gobble]

I would have loved to get FLoorstanders but my room dosent permit it.No space and plus my MOM wont allow me.I was thinking some bookshelf with large woofer size I guess 6.5" should be suffice.But budget is another constraint. Need to find the right balance.This system will be exclusively used only for Music. Movies I prefer watching them at theaters.(tough I do have a huge collection of movies).

Ummm You will lose out on SQ if you place the bookshelfs like 9.2 close to the wall. For best sound the speakers cones need to be atleast 3ft away from the rear/side walls. The WF manual recommends 0.7mtrs from side wall and approx 21" from rear, but its not sufficient I feel. I am losing out on whatever 3D soundstage the speakers may be capable of because I cannot let speakers intrude further into my space - its only a 10x12 bedroom and I already have them about 2 feet away from either wall. So I will have to forsake that discovery till I move out to a larger place.

If you plan to wall mount then better search for a pair of suitable surround speakers with woofer that can be tucked away in the corner. The Lithos Noa-1 is apt for this and I urge you to audition them.

And yes min 2 mtrs gap between speakers is important for the WFs

Regards

 

[magma]

i agree.
the warfedales require more place.
consider the KEF or MA BR2 if space is slightly less.
dont even think about a rear vented speaker

 

[gobble]

The WF manual recommends 0.7mtrs from side wall and approx 21" from rear, but its not sufficient I feel.

Correction : 0.7mts to 1mtr from side wall and 0.2mtrs to 1mts ( measured from rear side of speaker not cone) from rear. That ties in with 3+ ft optimal distance perception.

Wall mountable speakers are best for your situation.

Regards

 

[asliarun]

Can Acoustic Portrait speakers be considered? Haven't heard them personally, but they seem to have a couple of good bookshelves: TC1 at 10k and MS101 at 20k. The MS101 has a larger driver (6.5" Vifa I believe) and goes down to 45Hz. Has anyone heard or owned any of these speakers?

 

[venkatcr]

Correction : 0.7mts to 1mtr from side wall and 0.2mtrs to 1mts ( measured from rear side of speaker not cone) from rear. That ties in with 3+ ft optimal distance perception. Wall mountable speakers are best for your situation.

As part of setting up an HT system for a friend of mine, I have purchased 4 PSB Alpha B1s. These speakers have ports on the rear. I was generally thinking my friend would agree to good stands, but he shocked me saying they have to be wall mounted.

Though the PSBs have a small hole on the back as well as two screw holes, both these meant they will be flush with the wall or very close. I looked desperately all around the world literally for a wall stand. Located a company in Italy (Support Watch TV Supporti per TV, Hi Fi, Casse Acustiche, Microonde e Computer) that has a a product called ULYSSES that is a good wall mount for speakers. I was contemplating all kinds of transactions - calling them, sending them a DD etc.

Then day before, I decided to go along with Raghu of Decibel and visit some shops in Chennai that have wall stands for TV. We went to a couple of shops and came back disappointed. Torvin had a wall holder but for very small speakers. Other shops had TV wall stands with a large plates on which you can place the speakers. But how do you grip the speaker firmly?

As we were walking back dejectedly to the car, Raghu suddenly turned around and disappeared into a small shop in a bylane in Ritchie Street. And in that shop we hit pay dirt. We came across this product by a company called Royal Look that had exactly the product we were looking for. It has a firm bracket that is bolted with four screw to the wall, and a holder that not only swivels but also has a adjustable width to place the speakers on. The base bracket that comes from the wall is available in varying lengths, giving you a distance of 12 to 20 inches from the wall to the rear of the speakers. And you can toe-in the speakers to maximise your sweet spot. In addition to all this, the wall mounts can hold up to 25 kgs.

I immediately bought four at a ridiculous price of Rs.175 each.

Please look up product called RL-SP-S in :: Welcome to Royal Look ::.

Cheers

 

[prakasse]

Great find Venkat and that too 175/- a piece...

 

[gobble]

Cool product. If one can angle it 15 - 45 degrees to the wall, should work for those that want to save space.

Cheers

 

[biyer]

Hi Venkat . really cool product but does it really hold that much weight and does it come with screws?

I am planning to get eiether the wharfedale diamond 9.1 and 9.2 both dont weight much.

 

[magma]

sorry for the post, i found the answer after all

 

[venkatcr]

Hi Venkat . really cool product but does it really hold that much weight and does it come with screws? I am planning to get eiether the wharfedale diamond 9.1 and 9.2 both dont weight much.

You mean screws that go into the wall? Yes it does along with wooden plugs that you can insert into the wall. I would rather use a plastic wall plug with some Fevicol and use that instead of the large and ugly wooden plugs it comes with. Please see Stock Images of Pile of plastic wall plugs 451016 - Search Stock Photography, Photos, Pictures, and Photo Clip Art - 451016.jpg to get an idea of these plugs. They are available in abundance in India. The advantage is that as you turn the screw, the plug expands and grips very tightly to the wall.

The product is made of sheet metal, and can easily hold 25 KG or so.

Cheers