Yamaha V6A or Denon 2600 or something else?

[sandeepmohan]

Woah. Slow down.
Why are you swapping the receiver for insufficient sub out put? This sounds like a bad setup or sub woofer problem.

What are you using to evaluate? Blu Ray or Streaming platforms with 5.1 native audio output?

MCACC should allow you to alter the stored settings. If it has incorrectly set up parameters run it again and check. Maybe there was a lot of external noise when you ran the setup and it resulted in poor calibration of the system.

I suspect your phase control is set wrong either on the receiver or the sub woofer so bass is just being canceled out.

Set the sub woofer power switch to ON and not Auto Standy By
Set the front main speaker cross over frequency to 60Hz. Center can be 80Hz. On the receiver.
Set the sub woofer cross over at Max, on the sub woofer.
Set the sub woofer volume just over the 12am mark.
Start with the Phase at 0. Check to see where you get more bass, at 0, 90 (12am) or 180. When you hear more bass, leave it there.
MCACC also has phase control. Check that it matches to what is set on the sub woofer.
When you had run MCACC, did you hear the sub being tested with a test tone?
Data Check all the MCACC parameters.
Check for movement of the sub woofer driver.
Try enabling Double Bass (last option to try)
When you do hear the sub woofer, gradually increase or decrease the channel level in .5db steps. On the receiver.

 

[amrutmhatre90]

Hi Sandeep,

Thanks for your advice. I am using blu ray most of the time, I know streaming platforms may not provide accurate sound.

I have already done and got above settings right. Thanks for the help. But MCACC is very limited in terms of alternating, only channel level can be done, double bass is not what i prefer. Cannot set individual crossovers for speakers.

I think you got me wrong, bass is present from the subwoofer. It is just not hitting the chest and the midrange is lacking. I had swapped my receiver for few days with a Marantz SR5012 and I noticed a huge difference. It was day and night.

Sound is not only the reason, why I am upgrading but rather future proofing. I have the new gen Consoles, ALLM, VRR etc can be used through HDMI 2.1 or eARC if my TV supports. Both of which my old receiver lack. Would be upgrading the TV after the AVR upgrade too, this year many new TVs with HDMI 2.1 and all these features would launch. Redmi already has launched it but would ignore it for now would look for a better TV.

Getting a good value for the resale on my old AVR, which is still in warranty. Upgrade would cost me 25k.

 

[bombayduck]

Denon 2600 was available for 70k
Denon 2700 is ranging between 73-78k but one can bargain more.
V6A is not available anyplace except for https://yamahamusicstore.in
Had called them looks authentic. Costs 64-65k

I am going 90% for Denon has better customization and so on. But open for your views.

I am also looking to buy the Denon 2700. Could you share the name of the dealer you plan to buy from?

 

[sandeepmohan]

Getting a good value for the resale on my old AVR, which is still in warranty. Upgrade would cost me 25k.

By all means, go ahead and upgrade your receiver. All I am saying is to do your research well before doing so. I find it hard to believe that the receiver is contributing to lack of bass. All they do is feed a low pass signal. Every receiver does this so it comes as a surprise to me that you can't solve this with what you already have. Unless, there is something really wrong with the pre outs on the receiver itself which is not allowing the sub to reach its full potential. In this case, you're basically passing the problem to someone else.

Why is midrange required out of a sub woofer? You have a full range speaker that can do midrange.

Check your phase and gain settings. MCACC does allow for some control. I am not sure what Pioneer have done with your 834. I had a 1122k, 6 years ago and MCACC allowed a whole host of adjustments. I find it hard to believe that a receiver a lot newer can't do it. You have a Sub woofer EQ too.

Do keep in mind that you can override MCACC settings. Yes, it does need some work. You may have to measure the room dimensions yourself but that is a one time process.

I'll tell you one thing about home theater and future proofing. Its all a scam. Whatever you buy today will be outdated in one or two years time. Personally; I don't care if my receiver can't handle high refresh rate signals or deal with ethernet over hdmi. Its essentially a video switcher and audio processor. If you want high refresh rate, feed it directly to the TV and let the receiver handle audio over HDMI ARC. The very next day from when you buy your new receiver, I guarantee you, there will be dArc and that will be the next excuse to upgrade, again. Instead of blowing another 25k on a new receiver, direct it in a way that it can improve your overall sound or video. Don't upgrade for reasons like lack of eArc or lack of HDMI 2.1. Honestly, I don't think you're going to miss much.

As your receiver is still under warranty, inform your dealer of what you are going through. They are supposed to help you in situations like this.

Good luck.

 

[efernand1]

@amrutmhatre90 I do echo what @sandeepmohan has listed down in detail!

Yes I agree that the SQ between a Pioneer and Marantz is indeed night and day but when you purchased the system I am sure you would have auditioned other ones and got something which was within the budget you had at that time and met your expectations!



Possibly the subwoofer could be the culprit that you are not enjoying the system anymore, have you tried to place the subwoofer where permissible in the room differently? You need to give it time if placed in a new spot and hear it for a few days to see if it made any difference?

You can try replacing the subwoofer cable and check if that is the issue....alternately most subs have Crossover in and Crossover Out settings....try using that....

In order to do the above and tweak settings.....you need to ensure you go through the operation manuals of AVR and Subwoofer to ensure that you have tried everything before making an upgrade / change in systems. Understand also the limitations and capability of the speakers and make some adjustments...Weekly keep changing the settings to understand what works well and sounds good for you. Ensure you check with media content you are familiar with and also random inputs or TV shows or OTT series which will also help to assess.

A quick example,
I had a SR6009 for 3 years, sold it last year and picked a SR5014 thinking it is latest and would impress me, I didnt enjoy the SQ and built quality, speakers are same and so is the room which is small, a NR series is more than enough for my place.
Due to features of pre out, built quality and Audessey version, I am with SR series for the last 6+ years. I sold the SR5014 within 2 months and picked a SR6010 which may seem outdated (Latest being SR6015) but has all the requirements I need in terms of functionality, main thing is Audyssey version Multi EQ XT 32 which is top of the line for me and works like a charm. Again my room is same, same speakers and sub, no changes there....loving the SQ and Video processing I need for inputs from my Laptop to play media files, Youtube, Netflix (5.1 or 7.1 or atmos) and a dedicated Blu Ray player for Discs etc.

Audyssey settings are conservative for levels and tonal adjustments, I tweak the speaker levels further if required based on their capability and specs. As for me I like the subwoofer to blend in with other speakers and emit those low frequencies which are not outputted from the other speakers....I am not a bass head to make my room a pub or club or discotheque! Some like their bass too loud and hence prefer to make the sub sound muddy! Audyssey results as Reference settings which i change to Flat...this works well for me and I have done weeks of testing and checking before I finalised my true sweet spot which I enjoy. Been using Marantz for more than 9 years now...used Pioneer, Harman Kardon, Yamaha and even Denon in the past which did not appeal to SQ the way I would like to hear it.

This is my view, I am sure others share more or less similar experiences or would be different! It all depends at the end of the day as in what you like, what you want within budget etc. Trust your ears and be sure before making any investment or upgrade!

 

[spirovious]

I had a SR6009 for 3 years, sold it last year and picked a SR5014 thinking it is latest and would impress me, I didnt enjoy the SQ a

I guess 009 series is warm sounding and 014 is little sharp one. Also 6 series sounds better than 5 series. I had sr5006 and sr6006 in past and 6006 was much better sounding Avr than 5006 which was from same series.

 

[amrutmhatre90]

Agree with you all.

Their is no problem with subwoofer or the pioneer. Bass is present, LFE is present. But the thump or punch which hits the chest is missing. And the mids from the speakers. I have done the crawl and found an optimum position for the sub and is placed there.

The receiver I got was already a over stretch for me, it was a new learning curve. But it was the cheapest 7.2 Dolby Atmos receiver one could get. The only changes for sound in this receiver are channel levels and tone. Lets say I set crossover of 80 it will apply to all of my speakers, wouldn't bother about this much as I think 80 is a sweet spot. But doesn't have any sub EQ or speaker EQ to change. MCACC only has setting of on or off. This receiver doesn't come with network or wifi. Link to Pioneer website

I'll just brief my settings here.
Sub - crossover set to max
Phase - 0
Volume - 50%
On always

AVR - Crossover 80
Phase filter - On
MCACC EQ - On
Theatre filter - Off
Subwoofer channel level - +2
Fronts - - 1
Centre - 0
Surrounds - +0.5
Heights - +2.5
Tone - both bass and treble at 0

These are the settings currently I use and have been using for quite some time. I never said I am not liking the setup or I hate it. It is good for the cost I invested earlier, but this can get a little bit better after few sound tweaks which the pioneer cannot do. Speakers full potential is somewhat left unused.

I agree about the tech getting outdated every now and then, I was infact even ready to go for Denon 3600 just cause it has a Xt32 but it is not available anyplace. But if I wait now and stick with my current receiver I won't get the price What I am getting now in future. Investing for a good receiver will be a stretch.

Just summarising points making me want to upgrade.
- TV to receiver Dolby Atmos content can be done only through eARC
- Sound tweaking abilities and save multiple different sound profiles on the go.
- Better amplifier and high wattage

Following are ok to have.
- ALLM, VRR and HDMI 2.1
- Wifi and network capabilities

If I already owned a mid range or higher end receiver, wouldn't have upgraded. To me 834 is just an entry level receiver. Back then did not have much funds, but slowly got what I wanted out of my Home Theater. I would rate my system 7/10 few changes would bring it up

 

[sandeepmohan]

The receiver I got was already a over stretch for me, it was a new learning curve. But it was the cheapest 7.2 Dolby Atmos receiver one could get.

This is the mistake many make. I did too. Find the cheapest with everything feature wise and buy it. The concept of sound quality or performance goes out the window as we are always focused on bells and whistles, most of which are useless.

By all means upgrade but don't do it in a hurry. Audition everything you can. Take your time. The lack of eArc isn't the end of the world.

I use a Denon AVR-3312 (You can do the research on how old it is). Yes, I did buy it used as I do not have several lacs for the latest and greatest but then I realized, I don't need all that. This Denon has dual HDMI outputs (Yes only 1.4), 7 HDMI inputs, a wired Network input, Audyssey, 7 *125 (Is a joke actually). I feed my 4k ultra hd blu ray player direct to the TV and use arc for DTS HD Master or any TV audio. As is obvious, I don't have Atmos and I don't miss it. Yes I hear its pretty amazing but I am in no hurry as my disc collection does not have Atmos tracks. Yes I would like some additional grunt and guess what, I can upgrade with a external amplifier as the receiver has pre outs for all channels. Till then, I need to crank up the gain to 70% if I need to shake the room, which is fine for me. No chest thumping bass here as my sub woofer is just an 8" driver with a 100 watt amplifier. What I do have is solid, tight and not over powering bass. Maybe your requirements are different.

The link you sent for your 834 indicates presence of Sub EQ and Phase control in the specifications. The power specifications are rather hopeless though at barely 30 watts per channel (these are receiver watts) with 5 channel operation. With all 7 channels it will be even lower. This is obviously not going to wake up many speakers.

Do you know what Double Bass does? From what I've been reading, it passes all low frequency signals from other channels to the sub woofer pre out. Worth a try, if you have not tried it. This is not a loudness control. It sounds like Pioneers version of LPF+LFE (In Denon Marantz language)

I am not sure what phase filter does so you might want to turn it off and check if it does anything to the sound.

In your view, what function or benefit do you gain with networking on the receiver?

You can dial up the sub woofer gain on the receiver and check for changes to the sound.
You can increase the gain on the sub woofer too. Maybe the lfe feed is low, so try 2pm position and check.

I'd say start with getting your main speakers to sound right. Switch off your sub woofer for this. Once you get the sound you want from them, introduce the sub into the system gradually and listen for bass. These steps take time. It took me over a week and after a week of being happy, I realized something was amiss and then I reverted on some settings which I first thought sounded right.

 

[amrutmhatre90]

Thank you Sandeep.

Ya mistakes help us learn.

Double bass passes all of the bass to the subwoofer is what I know. Did not like how it sounds.
Phase filter matches the frequency of the Sub and Speakers, ya it does work so kept it On.

Dunno how it is mentioned here about the Subwoofer EQ but it is not present.

Attaching a screenshot on what MCACC offers.

 

[amrutmhatre90]

Well new update.
This is funny, the Yamaha V6A is not able to out 4k 60hz on the Xbox Series X.

Techno Dad did a great job of testing this out, but sad reality of the V6A.

Attaching few screen grabs.



Anyone using the V6A can confirm this?

 

[OM_2K19]

Well new update.
This is funny, the Yamaha V6A is not able to out 4k 60hz on the Xbox Series X.

Techno Dad did a great job of testing this out, but sad reality of the V6A.

Attaching few screen grabs. View attachment 56457

View attachment 56458

Anyone using the V6A can confirm this?

This may give you some clue.

New setup won't run 4K @ 60Hz

I've connected my Samsung Q8FN TV to the new Yamaha RX-V6A receiver via HDMI 2.1-compliant cabling. I've connected my Win10 gaming PC w/ GTX 1070TI GPU via the same class of cabling. When the PC is connected directly to the TV via HDMI, 4k@60hz works as expected. When the PC is connected to...

www.avsforum.com

 

[rshri]

Last June/July, this was retailing around 55K in most of the Metros. 70K is daylight robbing.

So this is not the best time to buy AVR?

 

[OM_2K19]

So this is not the best time to buy AVR?

It's worth waiting, right now prices are highly inflated.

 

[khemkamk]

@gurujee I was also planning on the Yamaha RX-V4A but like you said its out of stock everywhere.. can you pls tell me where you got the quote of 41.5k for this equipment? Thank you,

 

[gurujee]

@gurujee I was also planning on the Yamaha RX-V4A but like you said its out of stock everywhere.. can you pls tell me where you got the quote of 41.5k for this equipment? Thank you,

Avstore.in and avbestbuy
Both of them have quoted around 42k

 

[amrutmhatre90]

@gurujee I was also planning on the Yamaha RX-V4A but like you said its out of stock everywhere.. can you pls tell me where you got the quote of 41.5k for this equipment? Thank you,

Any specific reason you are looking to buy V4A?

I would hold of recent Yamaha purchases till they sort out issues.

 

[amrutmhatre90]

Well the bullet has been bit.

Everything went as plan, sold my old receiver with a spare speaker package at a good price. New owner will be happy too.

Ordered new receiver, waiting for it to arrive
Guess which one is it.

 

[amrutmhatre90]

Guess who is here

 

[sandeepmohan]

Nice.
Let us know how it sounds.
Strange model designation. AVC generally stands for control amplifier. In this case, it has a power amplifier section too.

 

[spirovious]

Guess who is here View attachment 56790

Yes, I know this guy .
Congratulations .