Do you have the money that it takes to be an audiophile?

Murali,

Nowdays i see a lot of people buying expensive electronic goods because of the 'status' tag it comes along. People buy high end cell phones with no idea how to use its features, high powered bmw's audi's when in a city like Bombay you can only do 40kmph, Large size tv's just to match what the neighbour has bought. (I mean a lot not everyone so this forum folks can spare me)

I feel audio systems have not entered this race yet and are still safe. But i am not sure till when. Maybe in the future, people may buy expensive audio equipment just to show off but they will not listen to anything other than hindi film music.:eek:

Maybe few things i would agree but most of the above i would not.

We cannot change our city can we? Does that mean we should all have a Maruti 800 as that is enough of a car on our roads? Why only bombay, most of our country is in the same boat, so should the average Indian with some money in his pocket deprive himself of the joys/comforts/ of a better car in his lifetime?
Secondly what if the person rally likes 'hindi film music'. Should he start listening to something else just to fit in or just listen to something he does not care for JUST cause it sounds good on his HIFI?
I agree on the cell phone angle as its a craze among the teens, but even so its actually 'his' money and he/she is free to use it as he/she chooses. If its to flaunt then so be it!
Rgds
 
YES i so absolutely believe u Suri:D
I can imagine u listening to a beautiful set up in scorching heat without an AC or a fan!!! Point is can one appreciate that great set up when one is not comfortable? I cant and I hence conclude that i am no audiophile!
Phew feel better without the added 'tag' already.
Rgds

I think max would be one or two songs - after that it does get tiresome!

but some of them are worth listening to this way - when the music rises to a crescendo and then suddenly stops - the pitch-black of silence, that bottomless depth and then - against this darkness you hear the faint altissimo of a wind instrument, and this rises in amplitude alone till it is joined by it's fellows towards the fortissimo - for all this the fans need to be off!

And dinyaar, there is no easy escape for you! - the very fact that you are on this forum attaches that tag to you.

in fact, any member who lasts for more than a week on this forum is an audiophile, and the peerless audiophile in our forum - THE KING of audiophiledom should be our MANUBHAI - who is looking for the ultimate in BASS reproduction.
 
Hi all,

You will have to excuse me, but I am a bit puzzled by the discussions here. Very genuinely, I have not quite understood the pulse of at least some of it.

When I first became economically independent as a graduate student (under a teaching associateship) in the US at the age of 22 (in 1981/82), I bought a small cassette player/recorder (mono, I think) made by GE for around USD 30. I was so happy to have this little instrument, it's actually difficult to express in words. I used to play all the cassettes that I got from India and in addition I used to record all the famous Indian classical musicians who used to perform in Pittsburgh. I still have Bhimsen Joshi's full performance recorded in that GE (I even got the three cassettes signed by him) in normal bias Sony cassettes. It's not true that at that time I did not know how audio could sound better, because on almost every weekend I was invited to some family (Bengali, Maharashtrian, Kannada, Tamil, Keralite and so on) who used give me home cooked quality Indian food and in exchange I had to sing for them. Most of these people had decent stereo separate systems and many of them used to record my singing in those systems using microphones and mixers etc. I sure knew there were better systems available than my GE, but I was still very proud of my little GE cassette record player and used it and enjoyed it very extensively.

Then after a couple of years of very extensive and almost constant use, that GE started giving some problems, but was still working. At that point I bought a stereo 2-in-1 (AM/FM radio cum cassette) with separable speakers from a brand called Magnavox for about USD 150. I was really amazed to notice the difference a stereo equipment could do (as opposed to a mono). This was also the time my musical horizon started expanding a bit beyond Indian boundaries. I became member of a Western classical music mail-order club and started ordering cassettes of Western classical music. I still have most of those cassettes (just a few days ago I played piano concertos by Chopin bought from that mail-order club on my current system). I also developed some liking for American soft pop. I remember I liked to listen to songs like "All Night Long" by Lionel Ritchie, also songs by Joan Baez.

Then I think in 1985/86 I bought my first stereo separates (all Technics) which consisted of a tuner, a cassette player/recorder, a TT, an amplifier and two medium sized bookshelf speakers. I got all this for under USD 500 from a store which was going out of business. Pankaj Shah, another Indian student doing PhD in Chemistry and my economic advisor at that time got the news of the sale of the century. We both drove to the store some 30 miles away and got the stuff home. The system became the envy of the entire student community living in that complex completely populated by students of all kinds. Around this time, knowing that I now have a TT, many people in the Indian community (settled there) who used to love me very much started giving me LPs as gifts on occasions and I also started buying quite a lot on my own. I still remember a certain Indira Sathyapriya Home who had (still has) a Bharathanatyam dance school gave me a host of LPs for composing the entire music of a dance drama that I did completely free of cost.

While I enjoyed my system tremendously, I also had the opportunity to hear a lot of excellent gear from around this time. I also could understand the roles of each component and how to pick and choose each. Some of my friends who took up jobs in industry right after a Masters degree, started getting settled and some of them bought really great systems. This was the time I got to hear a Nakamichi Dragon for the first time in my life and also bigger than human size electrostatic speakers, because such a friend got a very decent job in the Bell Labs and he bought a house and got all these stuff. I also lived in that house for the final six or so months before completion of my PhD.

After finishing my PhD and promptly getting married I decided to go to Europe for a post-doc. Pankaj (mentioned above) bought my all-Technics system from me for a very very attractive price. This was my first decent job. After the initial settling-in in a country where almost none of the common people spoke English, my wife and I started looking for decent stereo components. It started with buying a pair of Canton Karat 60 speakers on a demo-piece sale and as many of you know I still have those speakers and listen to them almost everyday.

I'll not bore you anymore with the rest of the story up to the point of my getting the Leben CS300 tube amplifier. But I have a point in telling you all this. I always loved music more than anything else. I am myself a musician. I always bought something that my pocket could "comfortably" allow. I have IMMENSELY enjoyed all my systems starting with the USD 30 GE cassette player to the USD 2500 Leben CS300. And I have been very proud to possess them all. In all this time, I have accumulated a tremendous amount of music (comfortably above a thousand hours, really do not know how much) to the point that it has become very difficult for me to keep all these in an organised manner. BTW, 99% of all my music purchase is still in tact and in top condition, so are my Harman Kardon amplifier and the Canton speakers.

If you really noticed, I am also very very happy to write all the above. I would never understand the dilemma which is the subject of this thread. I'd say: just follow your heart and pocket and be happy. I never worried about if I had too much or too less money for these things. Fortunately, my wife also never seriously interfered.

I do not know if any of this makes any sense to you. If it does, I'll be very happy.

Regards.
 
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Hi all,You will have to excuse me, but I am a bit puzzled by the discussions here. Very genuinely, I have not quite understood the pulse of at least some of it.

Hi Asit,

Yes, you are puzzled, and have not understood - that is because you love music in it's entirety and you are not too concerned about the reproduction apparatus (that is secondary to the understanding of the creative genius of the musician) and when you hear music you latch on to the music and enjoy it.

there are people of a different persuasion - people who do not really enjoy music per se, but enjoy exploring the (technical) abilities of a well-put-together audio reproducer - and it takes an instant (for the susceptible) to devolve from being a music lover to such a person (neither a music lover or an audiophile) -

i remember the day i descended into these depths - the day i heard the Rethm speakers in Cochin was the day i felt Lucifer's hand on my shoulder!:sad:

regards
 
Fellow audiophiles - and wanna be audiophiles - was wanting to chime in but Asit's post struck a chord - my story being I was a wanna be audiophile back in '86 when all I could afford was a cheap car stereo (i think it was a brand called takara which i bought in B'lore - with car stereo speakers placed in earthen pots for some low frequency re-inforcement - but guess what - music from Jacksons Thriller - FYC-Men at work-Bruce springsteen etc never sounded better - I was enthralled. Next for my obligatory MS in US in '90 - I bought a sony rack system from Montgomery Wards (store is long gone now) - I believe for $700 - financed on my first credit card - for which i think I paid $40 monthly - but what a system it was - graphic equalizer and all:eek:hyeah:
To make a long story short now my system has evolved close to $30k - plus I was a reviewer for SoundStage! - The Authority on High-End Audio - www.SoundStage.com - where systems costing $50 - $100k are quite normal - but you know what I enjoyed every moment of my evolution - from the earthen pot speakers to my B&W n805 and Usher be718 - and I still cherish my first brushes with good sound. In the end music is what matters - not how it is delivered - be it a $100k system or a $100 system.
Cheers:cheers:
Sid
 
Money can help someone to aquire audiophile grade equipment but money cannot make him/her audiophile. I think it is his/her passion, dedication, savings, understanding of music and learning skill that matures him/her as an audiophile over the period of time. I dont know how many people are there who can realy afford the equipment which reproduces the music exactly it was recorderd. Or how many are there who dont believe in this and let their ears decide whether that sound (may be coming from any grade equipment) make them smile and happy. I still use equilizer when listening to cassettes and vinyl. I like using it, but this may be a sin for any audiophile. when I started I was 18. It was walkman, assembled amplifier, two philips 8" speaker put over the matka. total cost was less than 1500 in year 1987. I used to get the cassettes recorded and waiting period was 1 month. That was in Nagpur during my Engineering days. Later when I started earning, the option was DNM,Norge and DIY Things changed & now I am 41 & have better brands but does having them make me audiophile? I dont think so. Quanlity is better but I still remember my music system of college days. The worry of spending Rs 50 on blank cassette and further 30/45 on recording during those days(Always short of money) and joy of good recording done by the shpowalla & further listening it on my matka system has simply no match evenif I spend much more on Blue ray/DVD or Audio CD today.
 
My final words...
This thread started from a young and eager person who has passion for music and wants to listen but is not sure how much and when to spend. Several similar young people joined the discussion and to all of them, I still reiterate this. Plan and spend wisely. You cannot have what you want overnight. As young people just starting life on your own, if you have the real passion, start saving a small portion of your disposal income after all your other needs. As years go, you will be able to get what you are really looking for. Read, listen and think, you will find out what you want. Always look around you for opportunities to own something you desire.

Overheard from a group of teachers assessing carrer prospects of their students:

* His handwriting is so poor and never improves: Doctor?
* He has very short memory: Politician?
* He doesn't flinch when lying: Lawyer?
* He never spends even the pocket money his parents give: Banker?
And finally,
* He always hears but never listens: Guess what???

I belong to that generation which was forced to think that "winning is great, playing is greater, loving is the greatest". Later, stark realities in life met us turning that upside down and realising how wrong we were. In the long run, we understood that a soldier survived on the border by his sheer abilities to kill the enemies (so that he doesn't get killed) and not just listening to the so-called patriotic songs of Lata Mangeshkar and Manoj Kumar movies and suicidal rushes. Our generation was compelled to witness movies showing everyone walking around (rather dancing) in > $1000 suites smoking Cuban cigars and drinking French wines, or scenes from all over the world where the Kapoors and Kumars could go and come.

Now there are young wise persons who have the passion for music and the future is yours. You have opportunities to explore the world and what it can offer, which we never had.

Good luck for budding audio lovers and happy listening.

Good bye.
murali
 
My final words...
This thread started from a young and eager person who has passion for music and wants to listen but is not sure how much and when to spend. Several similar young people joined the discussion and to all of them, I still reiterate this. Plan and spend wisely. You cannot have what you want overnight. As young people just starting life on your own, if you have the real passion, start saving a small portion of your disposal income after all your other needs. As years go, you will be able to get what you are really looking for. Read, listen and think, you will find out what you want. Always look around you for opportunities to own something you desire.

Overheard from a group of teachers assessing carrer prospects of their students:

* His handwriting is so poor and never improves: Doctor?
* He has very short memory: Politician?
* He doesn't flinch when lying: Lawyer?
* He never spends even the pocket money his parents give: Banker?
And finally,
* He always hears but never listens: Guess what???

I belong to that generation which was forced to think that "winning is great, playing is greater, loving is the greatest". Later, stark realities in life met us turning that upside down and realising how wrong we were. In the long run, we understood that a soldier survived on the border by his sheer abilities to kill the enemies (so that he doesn't get killed) and not just listening to the so-called patriotic songs of Lata Mangeshkar and Manoj Kumar movies and suicidal rushes. Our generation was compelled to witness movies showing everyone walking around (rather dancing) in > $1000 suites smoking Cuban cigars and drinking French wines, or scenes from all over the world where the Kapoors and Kumars could go and come.

Now there are young wise persons who have the passion for music and the future is yours. You have opportunities to explore the world and what it can offer, which we never had.

Good luck for budding audio lovers and happy listening.

Good bye.
murali

SAYONARA, Murali.
 
i think someone who is truly contended and at peace with his audio passions (be it music or equipment) would be one who would have attained a zen like state wherein he would hardly be bothered about saying anything about it....you could call it audio nirvana, a freedom from the endless cycle of posts and threads in hifivison....
 
i think someone who is truly contended and at peace with his audio passions (be it music or equipment) would be one who would have attained a zen like state wherein he would hardly be bothered about saying anything about it....you could call it audio nirvana, a freedom from the endless cycle of posts and threads in hifivison....

audio nirvana is a theoritical state,, chasing it will keep him unhappy forever, whoever truly believe such a stage exists
will keep upgrading on and on ....till end of life.
 
I think we should contact baba ramdev and ask for any yoga techniques which will help the listener experience audio nirvana from any setup :eek:hyeah:
 
And regarding India not being a favourable country for audiophiles, try sourcing out a quailty speaker of your choice and find out the Indian price versus the price elsewhere. That should give you an idea.

this is simple economics..nothing more.

as an example, Harbeth is overpriced in the US..much much more than in Asia. similiarly many of the US Speaker brands are more than 30% higher in europe (Inclusive of their import duty)

if you do buy a cadence or a Rethm which are exported abroad you will pay much more in the US or Europe.

The basic reason for the high prices in india is nothing more than not enough demand.
At one time LCD TVs and Cell phones were overpriced in india..today you get them at extremely good rates. Ditto for the computer industry.
 
i think someone who is truly contended and at peace with his audio passions (be it music or equipment) would be one who would have attained a zen like state wherein he would hardly be bothered about saying anything about it....you could call it audio nirvana, a freedom from the endless cycle of posts and threads in hifivison....

being content is the end to learning = death-like-trance-state! (http://www.hifivision.com/diy/1345-diy-audio-rack-justcad-design-3.html)

no, will not be content, and will upgrade till alzheimer's strikes!:)
 
could it be that given all those frighteningly long and involved hours that we spend here in this forum we are looking for something else or something more, besides audio nirvana???
(of course i was just speaking for myself..since at times i have committed the sacrilege of hanging out longer in hifivision than actually listening to music....)
 
could it be that given all those frighteningly long and involved hours that we spend here in this forum we are looking for something else or something more, besides audio nirvana???
(of course i was just speaking for myself..since at times i have committed the sacrilege of hanging out longer in hifivision than actually listening to music....)

hey moktan, all of us look to spend our spare seconds, our spare minutes, our spare hours, our spare days and all those mortal moments doing things we like till we die - and if our fancy lies with typing into this forum at this point in our matrix - well, power to us!:) - and sometimes our fancy might turn to revving those vtec and vanos motors to their limit and become the ultimate road warriors (on a circuit) - well, power to us!

regards
 
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