My frugal reference loudspeaker with Philips Fullrange.

t.antony

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I used these speakers first time in my college days, as the funds were limited, two clay pots were used as enclosures in an attempt to improve the sound of my ancient ITT tape recorder. The diy amps were built around TDA 2020 and austereo tone controls from Visha kits. The combination sounded nice and eventually ended up as ceiling speakers in our dining room. That was about 20 years ago. This humble speaker again caught my attention some time back when I started experimenting with open baffle speakers. They sounded nice in the open baffle with good midrange and a clean sound that you can relax for hours without fatigue. This is a good driver but not an excellent one, and its strength is in the lower midrange. IMO they sound more full bodied in that region compared to a 4 or 5 inch driver. The focus of this project is to get the best out of this driver and try to compensate its deficiencies with the help of other drivers. So the word reference needs to be taken with a pinch of salt. The total driver cost for this project (6 drivers) is about INR 2200. This is my frugal attempt at high end using inexpensive-locally available drivers :).

As Philips speaker division is acquired by Boston Acoustics, currently this driver is available from their vendors. More information is at this thread. - http://www.hifivision.com/diy/12792-ts-parameters-philips-8inch.html

The enclosure is a mass loaded transmission line (ML-TL) employing forward and backward firing drivers(bipole). Conventional bipoles use the same type of drivers, I tried to use a combination of drivers of different parameters such that they complement each other. This project started out of curiosity and in due process resulted in rewarding interactions with some very knowledgeable individuals. I would especially like to mention Martin J King of quarterwave.com for his valuable advice and encouragement for this project. The wealth of information available at his site and his MathCAD worksheets were instrumental in this design .

As the full ranger is compromised at the highs, Another tweeter was brought in for 4khz onwards, Since I had a pair of Philips IX9101A soft dome tweeter available with me, ended up using them. While full ranger fires forward, another inexpensive woofer Dainty PF0802B was used as the rear-firing driver. Here is a sketch of the enclosure

sketchk.jpg


All the drivers I have chosen for this project are not known for their sonic abilities and its true that they do lack refinement. I am trying to use them in frequency bands where they produce least distortion, thus masking their deficiencies to a possible extent. The full ranger is an all paper driver and due to the extended range it can be crossed at a higher frequency this is advantageous as this single driver can cover the entire vocal band -200Hz to 3500Hz. A high crossover point will also reduce load and distortion on the tweeter. The woofers Fs is almost an octave below full ranger, so combined with the air column resonances of the enclosure it should be possible to attain better low frequency extension.

Since the enclosure is not a regular rectangular box, I chose to build a life size model in thermocol for the carpenter. Here is a picture.

mockupthermocol.jpg


The hollow stand will home the baffle step correction circuit and crossover components. Remaining area will be filled with sand, the cable will be drawn via this and terminate at the bottom.

I am thinking of attaching a phase plug for the full ranger to reduce on-axis beaming. Also there is a plan to fix the tweeter to this phase plug for a co-axial placement. Will update with pics.
 
t.antony,

do what you love and love what you do.... all the best !!

The speaker shape looks very nice. Hopefully many other more experienced friends like suri etc.. can chip in with ideas for you.

regards,
mpw
 
Winding inductors for the crossover and baffle step correction network is the next challenge. I found this DIY link which seems like a workable solution for making a cheap coil winder - DIY Hand-Driller Coil Winding Machine with Digital Counter.

Also here is another interesting DIY link for making a digital counter from a calculator. Versatile and Low Cost Digital Counter

This online calculator seems like a good option for making air-core multilayer coils. It gives the required wire length and weight as well. As I need inductors of high value (+6mH), air-core is going to be expensive and bulky, so probably I will use a laminated I-core.

Does anyone have an inductor winding chart in SWG? Also any idea where I can get laminated I core and bobbins in SP road. In my last visit, I tried couple of places including Universal Transformers but they does not seem to have them.
 
Your Thermocol model looks - WOW!!!!

The problem [acc. to me it is a problem] with bipoles is that they need to be well out into the room - less so if the 2nd driver is mounted to the side or top.
 
Since the enclosure is not a regular rectangular box, I chose to build a life size model in thermocol for the carpenter.

Your Thermocol model looks - WOW!!!!

The thermol idea is really a fabulous one. I was not finding a good carpenter for my Magico clones. I think this would be really a great idea to make Thermocol box and coat it may be with Fibreglass.
 
Hi

Antony,this is an interesting project. I will be looking out for your updates.



I am thinking of attaching a phase plug for the full ranger to reduce on-axis beaming. Also there is a plan to fix the tweeter to this phase plug for a co-axial placement. Will update with pics.


I like the idea of mounting the tweeter co-axialy. At higher frequencies time alignment becomes critical for coherent sound,you might have to address this in the crossover.


Regards
Rajiv
 
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Winding inductors for the crossover and baffle step correction network is the next challenge. I found this DIY link which seems like a workable solution for making a cheap coil winder - DIY Hand-Driller Coil Winding Machine with Digital Counter.

Also here is another interesting DIY link for making a digital counter from a calculator. Versatile and Low Cost Digital Counter

This online calculator seems like a good option for making air-core multilayer coils. It gives the required wire length and weight as well. As I need inductors of high value (+6mH), air-core is going to be expensive and bulky, so probably I will use a laminated I-core.

Does anyone have an inductor winding chart in SWG? Also any idea where I can get laminated I core and bobbins in SP road. In my last visit, I tried couple of places including Universal Transformers but they does not seem to have them.

Anthony,

Very impressive approach to speaker building. You also seem to have done quite a bit of ground work.

The Laminations including bobbins, enameled copper wire etc. are available in the bylanes (temple street) off BVK Iyengar road. GKW (Guest Keen Williams) makes CRGO laminations. You can talk to them for dealer info.

I have failed in my attempt to wind coils with hand. Half way through I lost both my hands and needed couple of days of rest to recover from pain.

BTW, I have a pair of vintage Philips Holland make 12" full range speakers in excellent condition. One of these days, I will put them to use.

Cheers.
 
with bipoles is that they need to be well out into the room

Yes, conventional bipoles need to be placed sufficiently away from the back to reduce the intensity of the rear reflections. This bipole is a bit different due to the use of different drivers and crossover selection - While the fullrange is using baffle step compensation, the woofer will be using a low-pass filter. So the reflected(reverberant) energy is not as strong as a conventional bipole to create big problems in the response - at least that's what the plan is :).The Mathcad models also didnot show any detrimental bass effects other than the wraparound suckout that occurs around 100hz, so I think this can be placed relatively closer to the back and side walls and the baffle step correction circuit can be used in a way to tune this distance.

- less so if the 2nd driver is mounted to the side or top.

Placing drivers at 90degrees has a risk of creating strong non-axial standing waves which could create unwanted interference to the tuning frequency in a short and wide enclosure like this. But this idea might work in a taller, narrower enclosure.

Regds...
 
I think this would be really a great idea to make Thermocol box and coat it may be with Fibreglass.

Wonderful idea captain, it might work very well as thermocol seems like a good sound damper and fiberglass will give a very rigid enclosure.

Regds...
 
At higher frequencies time alignment becomes critical for coherent sound,you might have to address this in the crossover.
Rajiv

Yes, when I tested my tweeter, the Fs seems to be around 1200hz, so I can probably cross it @ 2500 easily. Finding the exact acoustic centers is going to be a bit of trial and error. I will be using a PC based active crossover to fine tune the crossover slope & frequency.

Regds...
 
Anthony,

Very impressive approach to speaker building. You also seem to have done quite a bit of ground work.

The Laminations including bobbins, enameled copper wire etc. are available in the bylanes (temple street) off BVK Iyengar road. GKW (Guest Keen Williams) makes CRGO laminations. You can talk to them for dealer info.

I have failed in my attempt to wind coils with hand. Half way through I lost both my hands and needed couple of days of rest to recover from pain.

BTW, I have a pair of vintage Philips Holland make 12" full range speakers in excellent condition. One of these days, I will put them to use.

Cheers.

Anil,

Thanks for the info, another friend informed me that Jinanica Electronics in SP road sells a collection of cores and formers, they seems to have a catalog as well with permeability and other parameters etc. I will checkout them as well and post my findings.

You seem to be having a good collection of vintage drivers. I had a pair of 6 inch vintage Philips fullrangers that somehow disappeared after a small renovation at my ancestral home :sad:.

Cheers...
 
Anil,

Thanks for the info, another friend informed me that Jinanica Electronics in SP road sells a collection of cores and formers, they seems to have a catalog as well with permeability and other parameters etc. I will checkout them as well and post my findings.

You seem to be having a good collection of vintage drivers. I had a pair of 6 inch vintage Philips fullrangers that somehow disappeared after a small renovation at my ancestral home :sad:.

Cheers...

Great. Please post us on your search for cores and formers.

Though my father dabbled in lot of audio and lighting, some of the vintage stuff I have, are all bought by me on various trips in India and abroad or friends/employees carried them for me grudgingly. It is a different situation now, what with Borderlinx etc.

Cheers.
 
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>or friends/employees carried them for me grudgingly

I know what you mean..Mules ( including sons)dont mind carrying stuff up to a point, but after a few tube amps/ 12 inch sub drivers they draw the line. I have used up huge amounts of good will pursuing this hobby!
 
I called up Jinanica, they don't have laminated cores, but ferrites. The person who attended the phone was helpful and directed me here for laminated core - Laminations. There is a pdf download in that page with the standard core sizes and specifications. I did not call them since they are far from my place, but that pdf file will be useful for making inquiries.

Also got a catalog of Philips ferrite cores that Jinanica deals from this link(Where to Buy Components). The catalog is very informative and I think there might be some audio grade ferrites that can be used for crossover inductors. AFAIK, the ferrite core inductors can be used for low pass section without problems.. anyone have experience with them?

Regds...
 
Visited a tool shop at Madiwala to buy a hand drill - good ones were priced around 200, saw a small table top winder which seemed like a better option so bought it for 375 - it comes with a thick metal bush that doubles as a good coil former as well.

Also picked up a Chinese skipping rope with a revolution counter for Rs.35 from a roadside vendor. This can be easily connected to the winder to count the number of turns. So now I don't have to do surgery of calculator to make the digital counter :)

winder.jpg


Regds...
 
Visited a tool shop at Madiwala to buy a hand drill - good ones were priced around 200, saw a small table top winder which seemed like a better option so bought it for 375 - it comes with a thick metal bush that doubles as a good coil former as well.

Also picked up a Chinese skipping rope with a revolution counter for Rs.35 from a roadside vendor. This can be easily connected to the winder to count the number of turns. So now I don't have to do surgery of calculator to make the digital counter :)

winder.jpg


Regds...

This is awesome. Terrific creativity. Let me know if this works. Will solve the problem of winding inductors forever...
 
This is awesome. Terrific creativity. Let me know if this works. Will solve the problem of winding inductors forever...

Could'nt agree more.

Antony, you are ingenious.:clapping:

Regards
Rajiv
 
In the hand-held winding machine modified out of a hand drill, both hands are occupied. This frees both the hands and you would have far better control of the windings. Moreover, the manual revolution counter is far more simpler to implement. Brilliant ideas.
 
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