South Indian Carnatic Classical Music

[sivasarjun]

Kerala is the land of percussion.Rhythm seems to move us more than melody.While neihbouring Tamilnadu is famous for music.
Panchavadyam is an ensemble for five tala instruments.It was concieved by Venkichan swamy a legendary maddalm vidwan in the early 20th century.Although structurally not as coherent as the Melam, Panchavadyam allows scope for individual expressions of the artists.It is used mainly to accompany the deity on processions.
Another interesting thing is Chenda(Arguably the greatest drum in the world) is not used in Panchavadyam.
Cheers

 

[srramanujam]

to get myself back to the main purpose of revisiting the thread, to update on carnatic music albums that i like

1. Bharathiyar Songs - Mandolin U Shrinivas, Music Today. Cleanest renditions of Bharathiyar. The style is light and will probably appear to all listners.

2. Sangeetha Kalanidhi T.N.Krishnan Violin, Music Today. Completely uncomplicated and involving Violin performance

3. Visakha, Balamurali Krishna Vocal, Charsur Digital Works, Vocal at its calm best

4. Azhagha, Bombay Jayashri, Rajalakshmi Studios

5. Nimalmbari - Sikkhil Gurucharan Vocal, Rajalakshmi Studios


Will update this thread over a period of time.

I am going to listen to the Panchavadyam CD again tonight. The two flats below are both Malayalis and i waiting for the day they will come up and complain.

 

[kendun]

to get myself back to the main purpose of revisiting the thread, to update on carnatic music albums that i like

1. Bharathiyar Songs - Mandolin U Shrinivas, Music Today. Cleanest renditions of Bharathiyar. The style is light and will probably appear to all listners.

2. Sangeetha Kalanidhi T.N.Krishnan Violin, Music Today. Completely uncomplicated and involving Violin performance

3. Visakha, Balamurali Krishna Vocal, Charsur Digital Works, Vocal at its calm best

4. Azhagha, Bombay Jayashri, Rajalakshmi Studios

5. Nimalmbari - Sikkhil Gurucharan Vocal, Rajalakshmi Studios


Will update this thread over a period of time.

I am going to listen to the Panchavadyam CD again tonight. The two flats below are both Malayalis and i waiting for the day they will come up and complain.

Are these CDs available online srramanujam ?

 

[srramanujam]

Except for 1, which i believe is out of production now. Incidentally, that is the only Music Today production which has its CD Album Art and Text only in Tamil.

The rest should be available in landmarkonthenet (or) in the respective websites (Music Today and Charsur for sure, Rajalaxmi also has a good website, but i dont know if they sell online. You can check).

 

[kendun]

Thank you srramanujam .

 

[sgmane]

Got the 12 CD set of Music Today release Maestro's Choice. 6 of Vocal, 6 of instrumental. (Its a mix of south and north - see the album list below.)
(Bhimsen Joshi, M Balamuralikrishna, Pt Jasraj, Mallikarjun Mansur, V Doreswami Iyengar, Maharajpuram Santhanam, Gangubai Hangal, Hariprasad Chaurasia, Ravi Shankar, Shiv Kumar Sharma, N Rajan, TN Krishnan). MRP 2599. Got it at Rs 799.
Just listened to veena of V Doreswami Iyengar, wonderful!!! Yet to listen to others!!!

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

The TNK Maestro's Choice CD was one of my first carnatic CDs. It is lovely.

 

[murali_n]

Hi Thad,

Raghuvamsa sudha is the pick of that album. Excellent Recording.

N.Murali

 

[ravidharap]

Dear all, thanks to you and the forum.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

Hi Thad,

Raghuvamsa sudha is the pick of that album. Excellent Recording.

N.Murali

It is, indeed, very sweet.

I saw T N Krishnan play last Friday evening ...in Singapore!

 

[crisscross]

While not Carnatic Classical. Blue Frog (Mumbai) has some excellent fusion stuff, they had Jonas Hellborg and Selvaganesh do a live show and it was mind blowing! They have live shows and while they have started offering CD's they don't have their entire collection on CD's yet.

 

[gobble]

Hmmm, after spending close to 10K on CDs many of them crossover carnatic/fusion I can only instinctively agree with the conservatives who call fusion a gimmick timepass and fooling around. It is simply lacking and "not there" where it matters most. There are rare exceptions like the french artist Nadaka who is able to capture the essence of the Indian way of letting music unfold, even with a guitar - with some great musical arrangements mixing other Indian instruments. I can count maybe less than 10 CDs if I compile the listenable ones from my collection of 100+.

I have a few forgettable CDS from Selvaganesh, Mahesh (who are the progeny of a great musician), and it makes me wonder why they ( and many others) do what they do after all the classical and traditional training they are privileged to have. Because they seem to abandon some basic principles in the presentation of music that I have only the ears for, but not the intellectual grasp or understanding born out of actual performing unfortunately. In a few albums, I can only blame the "phirang" star music performers dominating with his tastes and views about how music should sound and the Indian habit of willfully subjugating ones original ways to please the western visitor.

I dont have time to post details and qualify everything sorry - I am not interested. But there is something deeply truthful in the views of the conservative traditional Carnatic fraternity that I deeply value even as an outsider with no musical training. It is more a perspective born out of seeing with ones inner eye, through "Darhsan" - and not worthy of argumentative intellectual hocus-pocus.

--G

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

Ahhh, Gobble, you are so right.

A few weeks ago, I was sitting in a trendy new veggie restaurant. The background music was Nagumo --- with a drum track. It hurt. The soloists were playing flute and mandolin, and I don't know the names, but my suspicion is that a few good guesses would include them. It just made me wonder... WHY? These are educated musicians: what on earth could make any of think, for a moment, that Nagumo could be improved by a repetitive drum [machine probably] track? How, could they sit down afterwards, listen to their work and say, "Good: that works!" because it doesn't. Except, maybe, to sell CDs to buyers who don't know better.

I'll admit that I have been to several live performances of Vikku Vinayakram and family, sometimes including drums. I've seen Sivamani put on some wonderous shows, including classical percussionists. Zakir Hussain, too, has done some good stuff. Selvaganesh was better before he decided to imitate Zakir Hussain on stage. Most of the good stuff I have seen has probably been following the carnatic tala vadya kutchery format anyway... just including some extra instruments.

Most of the more fusiony stuff, to me, leads to confusion. I have seldom (there are exceptions) enjoyed it, so would certainly not buy it.

Strong feelings here too!

 

[gobble]

Thad

Glad to hear someone agrees!

There is one western rendition of Nagumomo that is most beautiful however.
It is a track from the album "Music for Crocodiles" by Susheela Raman. Absolutely lilting and scintillating in its courageous (in retrospect) and successful break-away from traditional rendition. :clapping:

A must buy album !

Do not however try and listen to her live performances to get a first impression. They flop miserably without the original studio musicians.

--G

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

I have a Susheela Raman cd from way back. i recall that, at the time, my rasika friends were appalled at the way she sang! Perhaps if carnatic music, to me too, was primarily about the sacred nature of the words, I might feel the same. Simply musically, though, I did enjoy it. I also like the way she tries to demonstrate carnatic concepts.

 

[Asit]

Gobble and Thad,

I was hesitating to comment, because my comments could be deemed biased, as some people in the forum know me as a hardcore classical music person.

Let me give my view anyway. First and foremost, I do not think one has to learn Indian classical music to appreciate it. I have done these experiments many times now in my life, in India and abroad, and have come to the firm conclusion that one has to just open their hearts to the music, keep the windows open, and there comes a time when people embrace it and then look for more depth. Indian classical music is by nature contemplative, one goes deep in oneself through this kind of music.

In my limited experience with fusion type of music, one only scratches the surface of Indian classical music (both Carnatic and north Indian, and I believe they differ only in form, but not in actual content) and hence one cannot really immerse in its depth. This of course is a personal observation. But for me, it does not involve me or haunt me for days to come, and does not help me go deeper into my own self and cannot uplift me from the my worldly senses. For me it's a compromise and is not a replacement for the better thing. For me it's not even a good introduction to Indian classical music for beginners. I honestly think some good film music is a far better introduction. And folk music is way better, because the roots of our music is there.

Call me a purist or whatever, but this, as I said, is only my personal view.

Regards.

 

[srramanujam]

Fusion and lounge music are music that people wont pay to hear. Thats why you hear them only in a lounge, elevator, telephone hold state and etc and thats what that music deserves.

I think it is an easy way for artistes who may not have the talent and, in any case, dont have the heart for hardwork to produce quality music.

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

But some of the artists (a few have been mentioned) are, undoubtedly, very talented.

Asit, I don't exclude the possibility of good "fusion". There is no reason why it should not score highly, at least on the entertainment level, if not on the depth of experience. Then, having said that, I'd have to argue with myself: my soul has been touched by Western classical as well as by Western rock music --- so why so seldom by "Fusion"

I think that one of the necessities for successful fusion, like successful jugalbandi (another genre that seldom delivers what it promises), is mutual understanding and accomplishment. I suspect that a lot of Indian musicians think that some trivial riff produced by a drum machine is western music, and wow, look, we're doing fusion! All they are doing is skimming a very shallow layer of pop, and trivialising their own music in the process.

Western music is often underestimated. I've watched Indian audiences going, "Oh, Wow!" when the western drummer follows in tisra nadai. Whilst I know that there is challenging stuff in carnatic rhythm, because I've discussed it with western musicians, something like that is hardly stunning for a trained, practising professional musician. (The other side of the coin is the western audiences that go insane when tabla players produce just a little plain tekka).

Fusion doesn't have to be bad; it isn't always bad, but, unfortunately, it just often is.

 

[srramanujam]

Agree totally, it doesnt have to be; but often is.

I dont know where Conversations and East meets West would be categorised. Are these fusion. Conversations gives me goose pimples every time i hear it. The first three songs in East meets West create such a fusion of Sitar and Violin, it is difficult to tell them apart.

Even Bombay Jayashri seems to lose it in some of her experiments with orchestra. So maybe Carnatic Music is what it is because of the depth. For fusion one needs to necessarily swim in shallow waters.

 

[moktan]

my two pence...
sometimes fusion does work, like in rock and roll. but i guess the synthesis has to happen over time, organically.
if fusion is being attempted to make something (i) more slick (ii) accessible (iii) commercial , then i guess it has its pitfalls...
but having said that, one of the collaborations that i have really enjoyed is between the Malian musician Ali Farka Tourre and the guitarist Ry Cooder...Talking Timbuctoo...now would i have been as impressed if i was a purist, aficionado of Malian music? i can't say...
or does the relative simplicity of folk music makes it more pliable to being fused..while classical music that is deeper would need more work?
as i said these are just my thoughts and my apologies if i have gone off topic...