Time Aligned Interconnect Cables

Hari Iyer

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A quarter of a grand in India is Rs. 250; that's very inexpensive. Congratulations on achieving what you claim for so less outlay.
25k is quarter grand of 1L in my books.YMMV.

For those who are interested in the technical aspect of this can refer this link. Maybe the US government is also a crazy bunch of idiots awarding a patent for this nonsense.


25k is quarter grand for 1L in my books. YMMV.
 
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Otpidus

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For those who are interested in the technical aspect of this can refer this link. Maybe the US government is also a crazy bunch of idiots awarding a patent for this nonsense.
Hari, I have a couple of points to mention. Firstly, filing a patent doesn't require proving the basis of the patent (I have filed a few such patents), unlike Papers published in a Peer Reviewed Journal. It’s just legal protection of an idea (may not be implementable with currently available technology or level of understanding of fundamentals) for a handsome fee to the exchequer.

Case in point, a couple of “Anti Gravity” based aircraft patents. We haven’t seen any of these taking off from our neighbourhood airports, let alone sit inside with a boarding pass in hand.
https://patents.google.com/patent/US10144532B2/en
https://patents.google.com/patent/US20060145019A1/en
Secondly, I went through the patent you mentioned. It’s a fancy description of a high resistance, high capacitance wire. Here one crucial point to note that most noises are weak compared to the main signal (signal to noise ratio). Hence a high resistance wire would further reduce the amplitude of noises along with the signal, making us feel a darker background.

I don’t doubt at all, your perceived improvement in sound quality with your cables but I agree with the majority here that it can’t be time alignment, at least to the best of my knowledge.
 
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RtoR King

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Hari, I have a couple of points to mention. Firstly, filing a patent doesn't require proving the basis of the patent (I have filed a few such patents), unlike Papers published in a Peer Reviewed Journal. It’s just legal protection of an idea (may not be implementable with currently available technology or level of understanding of fundamentals) for a handsome fee to the exchequer.

Case in point, a couple of “Anti Gravity” based aircraft patents. We haven’t seen any of these taking off from our neighbourhood airports, let alone sit inside with a boarding pass in hand.

https://patents.google.com/patent/US10144532B2/en

https://patents.google.com/patent/US20060145019A1/en

Secondly, I went through the patent you mentioned. It’s a fancy description of a high resistance, high capacitance wire. Here one crucial point to note that most noises are weak compared to the main signal (signal to noise ratio). Hence a high resistance wire would further reduce the amplitude of noises along with the signal, making us feel a darker background.

I don’t doubt at all, your perceived improvement in sound quality with your cables but I agree with the majority here that it can’t be time alignment, at least to the best of my knowledge.
Exactly, the United States Patent Office does not require any proof of concept to award a patent. They do perform a limited search for prior art and many times they miss stuff there. I was involved in such a patent law suit where prior art existed. I know of several audio snake oil products that have patents. Means nothing in terms of proof of performance.
 

drlowmu

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Hari,

There are several approaches one can take in the audio arts. One is to differentiate a sonic change, acknowledge it, and incorporate it into one's own future personal construction and uses. That is a direct and practical approach.

A whole other approach is to ascribe reasons ( correct or incorrect ) for a given result, reasons that are in synchronization with previously established and acknowledged relationships.

What people on both sides of this coin MUST realize is, there are incidents in real life, audio, etc., where the " non scientific" and " scientific" are 100% apart from each other. In such specific cases, neither side advances versus the truth. Both lose.

I prefer to be open to whatever is perceived, and not be reliant upon a requiring a " scientific " or " logical " explanation existing for something to be so. I think we should just be happy that we seem to have discovered and developed a consistent relationship, one that improves the overall result.

In life, people who think independently, are in the minority. You Hari, have to to decide what you are going to spend your time and attention upon. Maybe you should tell people " You don't know " what causes one set of cables'construction to sound different to your ears, than another. Then go on and develop cables !!!

Maybe we should say the same about an 8 feet pair of speaker cables sounding better than a 4 feet long pair of same-wire speaker cables. ( Pierre Sprey, RIP, Mapleshade ).

As an audiophile and music lover, what matters more to you, the lengths' net result .......or the reason it is so ??? Don't expend your energy and time on line needlessly and foolishly.

Jeff Medwin
 

Ravindra Desai

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Hello Hari, Long time. I admire your quest for betterment. Quantify your claim using a signal generator and an oscilloscope. You have to only show that HF races ahead of LF and MF for normal cables. If you can do that, then we all will want to buy your cable. b.t.w delay in ms is huge in audio. Take care.
 

spirovious

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To summarize, the air from the ceiling fan is not responsible for dispursing the high frequencies!
What about fan adding extra noise :)
Maybe we should say the same about an 8 feet pair of speaker cables sounding better than a 4 feet long pair of same-wire speaker cables.
Sometime they do sound little different depending on cable make.

Mod's Note:
Back to back posts have been merged. Multi-quote back to back posts in a single post to reduce clutter.
 
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drlowmu

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Hari,

There are several approaches one can take in the audio arts. One is to differentiate a sonic change, acknowledge it, and incorporate it into one's own future personal construction and uses. That is a direct and practical approach.

A whole other approach is to ascribe reasons ( correct or incorrect ) for a given result, reasons that are in synchronization with previously established and acknowledged relationships.

What people on both sides of this coin MUST realize is, there are incidents in real life, audio, etc., where the " non scientific" and " scientific" are 100% apart from each other. In such specific cases, neither side advances versus the truth. Both lose.

I prefer to be open to whatever is perceived, and not be reliant upon a requiring a " scientific " or " logical " explanation existing for something to be so. I think we should just be happy that we seem to have discovered and developed a consistent relationship, one that improves the overall result.

In life, people who think independently, are in the minority. You Hari, have to to decide what you are going to spend your time and attention upon. Maybe you should tell people " You don't know " what causes one set of cables'construction to sound different to your ears, than another. Then go on and develop cables !!!

Maybe we should say the same about an 8 feet pair of speaker cables sounding better than a 4 feet long pair of same-wire speaker cables. ( Pierre Sprey, RIP, Mapleshade ).

As an audiophile and music lover, what matters more to you, the lengths' net result .......or the reason it is so ??? Don't expend your energy and time on line needlessly and foolishly.

Jeff Medwin
Sometime they do sound little different depending on cable make.
We are referencing to the same exact cable types, as specifically denoted. The eight foot will sound better ( on a good system, not just mid-fidelity ) according to the late Pierre Sprey . ( read Pierre / Mapleshade below )

Actually, for AUDIO length, 114 1/4 inches sounds better than 57 1/8th inches, in the case of both speaker lead and AC feed lead lengths. The entire world is lost Hari, - behind us, with this particular knowledge.

In about 2019-20, I was told these wire length sonic differences showed up clearly on my Mentor's home audio system. He employs the only audio system to my knowledge - over the past forty plus years, capable to differentiate and to reliably make such a determination.

Jeff Medwin

Pierre Sprey Mapleshade WIRE TIPS   SAVE.JPG
 
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spirovious

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We are referencing to the same exact cable types, as specifically denoted
Yes, I mean same. But make or manufacturing may come with different results.
When I compared same monoprice speaker cable with different length in same setup, one sounded little sharp. But when I checked DAC extream cable with different length, they sounded same.
 

Dr.Gary

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We are referencing to the same exact cable types, as specifically denoted. The eight foot will sound better ( on a good system, not just mid-fidelity ) according to the late Pierre Sprey . ( read Pierre / Mapleshade below )

Actually, for AUDIO length, 114 1/4 inches sounds better than 57 1/8th inches, in the case of both speaker lead and AC feed lead lengths. The entire world is lost Hari, - behind us, with this particular knowledge.

In about 2019-20, I was told these wire length sonic differences showed up clearly on my Mentor's home audio system. He employs the only audio system to my knowledge - over the past forty plus years, capable to differentiate and to reliably make such a determination.

Jeff Medwin
View attachment 73068
You have previously stated that you are unable to hear differences between 114" and 57" lengths even on your personal ultra accurate and ultra revealing home audio system. If that is so, then any discussion of this issue is pointless because, according to you, there is only one person on planet earth (your mentor) who has a home system that is capable of revealing the sonic differences between 114" and 57" speaker and power cables that you claim exist. Worse yet, according to you, "the entire world (of audio) is lost" behind you and Hari with this particular knowledge".
We should all share our hearing test results here first !!!
I agree. And since it's your idea, I'll let you go first. Then drlowmu and all of the moderators.

Mod's Note:
Back to back posts have been merged. Multi-quote back to back posts in a single post to reduce clutter.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Hari Iyer

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Hello Hari, Long time. I admire your quest for betterment. Quantify your claim using a signal generator and an oscilloscope. You have to only show that HF races ahead of LF and MF for normal cables. If you can do that, then we all will want to buy your cable. b.t.w delay in ms is huge in audio. Take care.
Come home for a listen.
 

sachinchavan 15865

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Hari, I have a couple of points to mention. Firstly, filing a patent doesn't require proving the basis of the patent (I have filed a few such patents), unlike Papers published in a Peer Reviewed Journal. It’s just legal protection of an idea (may not be implementable with currently available technology or level of understanding of fundamentals) for a handsome fee to the exchequer.

Case in point, a couple of “Anti Gravity” based aircraft patents. We haven’t seen any of these taking off from our neighbourhood airports, let alone sit inside with a boarding pass in hand.

https://patents.google.com/patent/US10144532B2/en

https://patents.google.com/patent/US20060145019A1/en

Secondly, I went through the patent you mentioned. It’s a fancy description of a high resistance, high capacitance wire. Here one crucial point to note that most noises are weak compared to the main signal (signal to noise ratio). Hence a high resistance wire would further reduce the amplitude of noises along with the signal, making us feel a darker background.

I don’t doubt at all, your perceived improvement in sound quality with your cables but I agree with the majority here that it can’t be time alignment, at least to the best of my knowledge.
Appreciate the clarity and sensitivity in your reply. It’s exemplary to us all. We can be both right and nice.
 

Otpidus

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We are referencing to the same exact cable types, as specifically denoted. The eight foot will sound better ( on a good system, not just mid-fidelity ) according to the late Pierre Sprey . ( read Pierre / Mapleshade below )

Actually, for AUDIO length, 114 1/4 inches sounds better than 57 1/8th inches, in the case of both speaker lead and AC feed lead lengths. The entire world is lost Hari, - behind us, with this particular knowledge.

In about 2019-20, I was told these wire length sonic differences showed up clearly on my Mentor's home audio system. He employs the only audio system to my knowledge - over the past forty plus years, capable to differentiate and to reliably make such a determination.

Jeff Medwin


View attachment 73068
Jeff, being passionate about science and mathematics in particular, what struck me immediately is that the lengths you mentioned corresponds almost exactly with 180/Pi and 360/Pi. Since these are angular ratios, I couldn’t correlate these with any lengths. Thereafter, I switched over to wavelengths and the 57 1/8 inches matched with 206 MHz which is the VHF Band III. This was primarily used to transmit terrestrial TV signals either in PAL or NTSC format till the advent and adoption of DVB.

Here are a couple of interesting things happening. Firstly, the cable length becomes a near perfectly tuned antenna for the TV Broadcast. Secondly, each frame has a particular signature to denote end of frame, this signal repeats at 24Hz frame rate which can get into the audio signal and be heard as distortion.

So, it’s safe to assume that any unshielded cable of the said length or nearby length was not suitable as carrier for analog signal, specifically when residing close to a TV Station till early 2000.
 
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drlowmu

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Hello Hari, Long time. I admire your quest for betterment. Quantify your claim using a signal generator and an oscilloscope. You have to only show that HF races ahead of LF and MF for normal cables. If you can do that, then we all will want to buy your cable. b.t.w delay in ms is huge in audio. Take care.
In the early 1980s my then- first - audio - mentor, Mr. Robert W. Fulton, went to TEK's two Gig a Hertz bandwidth oscilloscope to study audio in his lab.

I can tell you he was totally FLOORED in our many phone conversations at how much more he saw, at 2 GIG, and how it all interacts.

It is more complex than people think !!!! He was much fascinated. Robert sadly died of cancer September 13, 1988.

By the way, I like your work !!

Jeff Medwin
 
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Dr.Gary

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Jeff, being passionate about science and mathematics in particular, what struck me immediately is that the lengths you mentioned corresponds almost exactly with 180/Pi and 360/Pi. Since these are angular ratios, I couldn’t correlate these with any lengths. Thereafter, I switched over to wavelengths and the 57 1/8 inches matched with 206 MHz which is the VHF Band III. This was primarily used to transmit terrestrial TV signals either in PAL or NTSC format till the advent and adoption of DVB.

Here are a couple of interesting things happening. Firstly, the cable length becomes a near perfectly tuned antenna for the TV Broadcast. Secondly, each frame has a particular signature to denote end of frame, this signal repeats at 24Hz frame rate which can get into the audio signal and be heard as distortion.

So, it’s safe to assume that any unshielded cable of the said length or nearby length was not suitable as carrier for analog signal, specifically when residing close to a TV Station till early 2000.
Interesting coincidences, but I fail to see what relevance they have in the way of explaining the alleged sonic difference between 57" and 114" loudspeaker and power cables in the environment that exists today (2022). Perhaps it would be helpful if you would provide more specifics as well as calculations that are relevant to these very short power and speaker cables that have extremely low resistance, capacitance and inductance and that are used in very low impedance portions of the audio environment..
.
 

Otpidus

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Interesting coincidences, but I fail to see what relevance they have in the way of explaining the alleged sonic difference between 57" and 114" loudspeaker and power cables in the environment that exists today (2022). Perhaps it would be helpful if you would provide more specifics as well as calculations that are relevant to these very short power and speaker cables that have extremely low resistance, capacitance and inductance and that are used in very low impedance portions of the audio environment..
.
Gary, while designing precision medical devices as well as in home audio, my experience with analog signal cables has been “Shorter the better”. Longer the cable, it’s surely going to be a tuned antenna for a particular frequency. 114 inch cable would definitely pickup more noise and interference than 57 one.

I didn’t mention power cables at all as their own EM Field is a problem irrespective of any length.
 
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bornfi

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Gary, while designing precision medical devices as well as in home audio, my experience with analog signal cables has been “Shorter the better”. Longer the cable, it’s surely going to be a tuned antenna for a particular frequency. 114 inch cable would definitely pickup more noise and interference than 57 one.

I didn’t mention power cables at all as their own EM Field is a problem irrespective of any length.
In the similar lines, if you were to choose between say, a 10ft speaker cable and 1ft interconnect (XLR) or 1ft speaker cable and 10 ft interconnect (XLR), what would you choose and why, if you could kindly explain? Basically, what I am trying to find out as to which option would be better in a setup consisting of a pair of monoblocks.
 

drlowmu

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In the similar lines, if you were to choose between say, a 10ft speaker cable and 1ft interconnect (XLR) or 1ft speaker cable and 10 ft interconnect (XLR), what would you choose and why, if you could kindly explain? Basically, what I am trying to find out as to which option would be better in a setup consisting of a pair of monoblocks.

Your desired answer was clearly addressed........ in Post #29 .......... above.

I was showing everyone the late Pierre Sprey's advice ...............from Mapleshade.

Paragraph three please.

Consider the magnitudes of these two signals. Which is most fragile.......and would be subject to the most subtle in transmission losses ???

Jeff

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Your two new Amps' ...... also make their AC cables, 114 1/14 inches long, 12 AWG, m22759/11/12, .... Apex Jr, Steve.
 
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rajan-

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When music pass through the conductors, depending upon the conductor used the HF will be ahead by a few msec in time compared to MF and LF. This will cause time smear of your signal causing your speakers to be more bright and sibilant to listen. The time aligned interconnect uses 6 different metals which have different awg size based on their resistivity and conductivity twisted to form a single conductor. This conductor is then sleeved in a silicone fibre glass insulator to build the interconnect cable as per the image. This type of geometry is known to have less time smear preventing sibilant sounding setups.
Since you made this, I take your words that it sounds different and better in your system.


Since the Signal goes through multiple active components (Pre / power amps) including different circuit boards, Volume pots, RCA connectors & internal wiring, what is your opinion about time smearing happening during each of these and how to eliminate them ?
 

RtoR King

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Gary, while designing precision medical devices as well as in home audio, my experience with analog signal cables has been “Shorter the better”. Longer the cable, it’s surely going to be a tuned antenna for a particular frequency. 114 inch cable would definitely pickup more noise and interference than 57 one.

I didn’t mention power cables at all as their own EM Field is a problem irrespective of any length.
Well yes. This has been known and solidly proven for at least 100 years. Now as you no doubt know, at RF frequencies, transmission line factors come into play and cable impedance becomes more critical. Still shorter is always better provided that is taken to consideration. But what is of question here is this 57&1/8in specific length, or multiples thereof. Your TV transmission theory is of some interest but keep in mind that every country has different RF spectrum allocations as well as different video formats, even in the an analog days. So this precise cable length is hardly universal in any case. The promoters of this theory have not been able to provide any peer reviewed scientific data to back up the claims.
 
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