Vincent SV 237 Mk2/ SV 228 models

[Nitin K]

Hi Fm's

Has anyone owned or experienced hearing this brand or the above mentioned model nos & how does it sound in person. I have been searching for an appropriate integrated amp for quite sometime after shorlisting a couple of amps . The dealer for Vincent is Watthifi in Gurugram. How does it sound as compared to a Marantz since that would be easier for me to relate since I have a Marantz. Demo for the Vincent is not possible in Mumbai since there are no dealers here. The website says German brand but not sure where it is made.
Also is it an issue to procure & regarding maintenance for tubes in India since I have absolutely no experience with tubes after owning solid state amps in the past. This will be used in HT bypass model for the avr while watching movies apart from stereo listening. Basically I am looking for a slightly warm relaxed sound with a decent amount of details but not micro details & avoiding a bright sound signature. Source would be cd's, wav & mp3's & maybe later on streaming. My speakers are Dali Oberon 1 with a Rel subwoofer.
Thanks in advance for any inputs.


Rgs,
Nitin

 

[Passive_audio_enthusiast]

Hi Fm's

Has anyone owned or experienced hearing this brand or the above mentioned model nos & how does it sound in person. I have been searching for an appropriate integrated amp for quite sometime after shorlisting a couple of amps . The dealer for Vincent is Watthifi in Gurugram. How does it sound as compared to a Marantz since that would be easier for me to relate since I have a Marantz. Demo for the Vincent is not possible in Mumbai since there are no dealers here. The website says German brand but not sure where it is made.
Also is it an issue to procure & regarding maintenance for tubes in India since I have absolutely no experience with tubes after owning solid state amps in the past. This will be used in HT bypass model for the avr while watching movies apart from stereo listening. Basically I am looking for a slightly warm relaxed sound with a decent amount of details but not micro details & avoiding a bright sound signature. Source would be cd's, wav & mp3's & maybe later on streaming. My speakers are Dali Oberon 1 with a Rel subwoofer.
Thanks in advance for any inputs.


Rgs,
Nitin

Vincent 236 mk has very good review by stereophile. https://www.stereophile.com/content/vincent-tubeline-sv-236mk-integrated-amplifier-page-2

These are upgraded versions of the same if m not wrong. But if your speaker sounds bright, may be you have already something which is reflecting the lower treble and upper treble too much in your room. Fitting an acoustic panel at that spot would magically transform the sound. If you have an already treated room, then adding a DSP, would do the magic. But if you need tube distortion sound then this might be the possible way.

 

[Nitin K]

Vincent 236 mk has very good review by stereophile. https://www.stereophile.com/content/vincent-tubeline-sv-236mk-integrated-amplifier-page-2

These are upgraded versions of the same if m not wrong. But if your speaker sounds bright, may be you have already something which is reflecting the lower treble and upper treble too much in your room. Fitting an acoustic panel at that spot would magically transform the sound. If you have an already treated room, then adding a DSP, would do the magic. But if you need tube distortion sound then this might be the possible way.

Thanks Passive_audio_enthusiast, This is their new line of their models which seems good in terms of build quality(going by reviews) & has tone controls, with decent power for the money.

Vincent SV-228 - Hybrid Integrated Amplifier

watthifi.com

Actually I need an integrated added to the HT setup where the stereo listening remains consistent where the tone is concerned, since avr's may change after a few years owing to change in formats/brands. In HT Bypass mode the integrated will act as a power amp for the avr.

 

[Phew]

The distributor for vincent I think is decibel in chennai, could get in touch with him for a demo if can be made available in mumbai.

"All [Vincent] products are designed and engineered in Germany," Frank Blöhbaum, engineering consultant to Vincent and a leading member of the design team, told me in an email. "Product manufacturing takes place in China, Germany, or a combination of the two. We have no unit which is 100% produced in Germany. Only the SA-T7, the SP-T700, and the new KHV-200 have final assembly in Germany." The SV-737 is manufactured in China.

https://www.stereophile.com/content/vincent-sv-737-integrated-amplifier

 

[jigarpatel]

 

[Nitin K]

The distributor for vincent I think is decibel in chennai, could get in touch with him for a demo if can be made available in mumbai.

"All [Vincent] products are designed and engineered in Germany," Frank Blöhbaum, engineering consultant to Vincent and a leading member of the design team, told me in an email. "Product manufacturing takes place in China, Germany, or a combination of the two. We have no unit which is 100% produced in Germany. Only the SA-T7, the SP-T700, and the new KHV-200 have final assembly in Germany." The SV-737 is manufactured in China.

https://www.stereophile.com/content/vincent-sv-737-integrated-amplifier

Thanks for the headsup Phew, I'll check with Decibel. The quote below is true regarding its designing & manufacturing.

 

[musiz_craze]

Vincent 236 mk has very good review by stereophile. https://www.stereophile.com/content/vincent-tubeline-sv-236mk-integrated-amplifier-page-2

These are upgraded versions of the same if m not wrong. But if your speaker sounds bright, may be you have already something which is reflecting the lower treble and upper treble too much in your room. Fitting an acoustic panel at that spot would magically transform the sound. If you have an already treated room, then adding a DSP, would do the magic. But if you need tube distortion sound then this might be the possible way.

Any idea how mid vocals sound ? Any chance you can compare it with marantz ?

 

[Passive_audio_enthusiast]

Any idea how mid vocals sound ? Any chance you can compare it with marantz ?

No idea, tubes generally have a very soft character (which is a spray of distortion). This effect is unique that it sounds more natural. You should try out at your home to see if it works with your particular speaker.

 

[Yelamanchili manohar]

Hi Nitin

Not the current mk2 model you are looking at. But happened to see this long discussion thread on the 237 model...maybe will give an indication of how they sound....happy reading

Vincent SV237 MK hybrid integrated amplifier Appreciation Thread*

In just over a week I will had my SV237 MK for 4 years. In the first 2 years I had some issues with random static and noise issues which were related...

forums.stevehoffman.tv

 

[Yelamanchili manohar]

looks absolutely gorgeous

 

[Yelamanchili manohar]

Hi Fm's

Has anyone owned or experienced hearing this brand or the above mentioned model nos & how does it sound in person. I have been searching for an appropriate integrated amp for quite sometime after shorlisting a couple of amps . The dealer for Vincent is Watthifi in Gurugram. How does it sound as compared to a Marantz since that would be easier for me to relate since I have a Marantz. Demo for the Vincent is not possible in Mumbai since there are no dealers here. The website says German brand but not sure where it is made.
Also is it an issue to procure & regarding maintenance for tubes in India since I have absolutely no experience with tubes after owning solid state amps in the past. This will be used in HT bypass model for the avr while watching movies apart from stereo listening. Basically I am looking for a slightly warm relaxed sound with a decent amount of details but not micro details & avoiding a bright sound signature. Source would be cd's, wav & mp3's & maybe later on streaming. My speakers are Dali Oberon 1 with a Rel subwoofer.
Thanks in advance for any inputs.


Rgs,
Nitin

Tube life will not be worrisome . Since the pre-stage is tubed, it uses small signal tubes with long tube life, they are usually good for 20,000 hrs or so. Besides, they use commonly available tube variants, so will not be difficult to find in India too. If they accommodate tube rolling, then you're in for a delightful ride

It is power tubes that wear out faster. And the exotic ones are difficult to find and expensive. But the pre-tubes are no problem at all.

 

[Yelamanchili manohar]

Tube life will not be worrisome . Since the pre-stage is tubed, it uses small signal tubes with long tube life, they are usually good for 20,000 hrs or so. Besides, they use commonly available tube variants, so will not be difficult to find in India too. If they accommodate tube rolling, then you're in for a delightful ride

It is power tubes that wear out faster. And the exotic ones are difficult to find and expensive. But the pre-tubes are no problem at all.

Just checked up on the specs, and seems they use 12AX7 and 6N1P's which should easily last upto 10,000 and 5,000 hrs respectively. Easy to obtain and are not too expensive. The design accommodates tube rolling, so one can replace the stock chinese tubes with better ones, for a noticeable improvement and can add different flavors to the sound. Has good power at 150W/8 ohms. Goes to 250W/4 ohms, which is close to doubling, so shows a healthy and robust power supply. First 10 W in class A, which is what most of us actually use. Considering the possibility of tube rolling and high bias class A design, I think it is safe to assume, that it wont sound bright or shrill ( Infact i think this will sound rich and lush ). And this comes very close to the holy grail of tube pre + class A power combo, in a single box.

And the best part is the build...simply impressive. If this was built in japan, or Europe, we could look at easily 3 times the asking price. Anyways, I will stop now, before I start sounding like a Vincent salesman

 

[Nitin K]

Thanks a lot Manu for taking the trouble to find & explain about the Vincent models. The SV 237 is out of my budget but am seriously considering the younger brother SV 228. It ticks all my prerequisites of a subwoofer input via pre-out, HT bypass & tone controls(which I really needed ) plus bonus are the vu meters which look great. I really like the vintage & understated solid design. The tone of the amp from user reviews is really what got me going.

As you have rightly mentioned, the build quality of the Vincent is great & would have costed almost twice if it were a popular brand. Apparently according to Vincent , tube rolling would make the warranty void. The tube maintenance is supposed to be low as it is in the pre stage. After the warranty period, the tubes can be surely changed. Had got in touch with WattHifi in Gurugram & Allegra Audio in Hyderabad & they do have the SV 228. Unfortunately there is no dealer in Mumbai where I can audition the SV 228. They have been favorably compared with Unison Research, Naim, Rogue & even Luxman.

 

[DB1989]

Hi Fm's

Has anyone owned or experienced hearing this brand or the above mentioned model nos & how does it sound in person. I have been searching for an appropriate integrated amp for quite sometime after shorlisting a couple of amps . The dealer for Vincent is Watthifi in Gurugram. How does it sound as compared to a Marantz since that would be easier for me to relate since I have a Marantz. Demo for the Vincent is not possible in Mumbai since there are no dealers here. The website says German brand but not sure where it is made.
Also is it an issue to procure & regarding maintenance for tubes in India since I have absolutely no experience with tubes after owning solid state amps in the past. This will be used in HT bypass model for the avr while watching movies apart from stereo listening. Basically I am looking for a slightly warm relaxed sound with a decent amount of details but not micro details & avoiding a bright sound signature. Source would be cd's, wav & mp3's & maybe later on streaming. My speakers are Dali Oberon 1 with a Rel subwoofer.
Thanks in advance for any inputs.


Rgs,
Nitin

@Nitin K - since you're spending the big bucks and are putting a lot of time and effort into it, why don't you come down to NCR to checkout the amplifier in person. Besides Watthifi, there are quite a few demo rooms with plenty esoteric gear worth checking out. And, you could also come listen to the Wilsenton R800i - its a serious contender if you want Class A and Tubes.

To put things into context through some anecdotal experience - Last night, I had this gentleman over who's had skin in the game for over 30-40 years and runs a pair of Avant Gardes and Zu Soul 6's driven by Nagra Monoblocks, Prima Luna Tube amps, 60kg McIntosh Monoblocks and what not. Suffice to say, he was " blown away" by the sound of the R800i paired with my humble Quad S5s and stated it was the "perfect sound" - i couldn't help sharing this as the smile plastered on my face since last evening simply refuses to fade.

Now, He was an incredibly nice gentleman so I'm not entirely sure whether he was just being kind but we've booked a next date for the R800i with the Avant Gardes

Now it's only a matter of booking a forklift!

P.S. - I exchanged notes with a few more folks who have the R800i and this one dude uses the R800i for to listen to music and a Luxman 509AX-II (currently there's a unit available for 4.6L with a friend if anyone's interested) as his daily driver for general media consumption - needless to say, he prefers the R800i - which is saying something because it was after hearing the very same Luxman model that I decided to go in for the R800i.

 

[Nitin K]

@Nitin K - since you're spending the big bucks and are putting a lot of time and effort into it, why don't you come down to NCR to checkout the amplifier in person. Besides Watthifi, there are quite a few demo rooms with plenty esoteric gear worth checking out. And, you could also come listen to the Wilsenton R800i - its a serious contender if you want Class A and Tubes.

To put things into context through some anecdotal experience - Last night, I had this gentleman over who's had skin in the game for over 30-40 years and runs a pair of Avant Gardes and Zu Soul 6's driven by Nagra Monoblocks, Prima Luna Tube amps, 60kg McIntosh Monoblocks and what not. Suffice to say, he was " blown away" by the sound of the R800i paired with my humble Quad S5s and stated it was the "perfect sound" - i couldn't help sharing this as the smile plastered on my face since last evening simply refuses to fade.

Now, He was an incredibly nice gentleman so I'm not entirely sure whether he was just being kind but we've booked a next date for the R800i with the Avant Gardes

Now it's only a matter of booking a forklift!

P.S. - I exchanged notes with a few more folks who have the R800i and this one dude uses the R800i for to listen to music and a Luxman 509AX-II (currently there's a unit available for 4.6L with a friend if anyone's interested) as his daily driver for general media consumption - needless to say, he prefers the R800i - which is saying something because it was after hearing the very same Luxman model that I decided to go in for the R800i.

Hi DB1989, thanks a lot for the input,. The R800i is a very popular amp. Actually I was not looking at a full pre & power tube amp. Basically something with minimum maintenance after having a few solid states over a period of time hence the hybrid may be a good change. The SV 237 MK 2 is out of my budget & the discounted price for the SV 228 is around 2.10 with taxes.
I had shortlisted O&B(Aniket Das), Marantz 40n(after the price falls) & the Vincent, will wait if something else also comes up. My selection process is very slow after having done some mistakes in the past & don't want to repeat them again

 

[DB1989]

Hi DB1989, thanks a lot for the input,. The R800i is a very popular amp. Actually I was not looking at a full pre & power tube amp. Basically something with minimum maintenance after having a few solid states over a period of time hence the hybrid may be a good change. The SV 237 MK 2 is out of my budget & the discounted price for the SV 228 is around 2.10 with taxes.
I had shortlisted O&B(Aniket Das), Marantz 40n(after the price falls) & the Vincent, will wait if something else also comes up. My selection process is very slow after having done some mistakes in the past & don't want to repeat them again

I get where you're coming from - the R800i does require a bit of care and effort to run. Some of the major gripes are having to switch it on and off every single time, lack of remote source selection (which makes no sense since the cheaper R8 can switch through the remote control), no subwoofer out and of course, the limited lifespan of tubes.

But, it just sounds so damn good! What I'm saying is check it out before deciding whether the abovesaid compromises are worth putting up with the inconvenience

 

[Phew]

Hi DB1989, thanks a lot for the input,. The R800i is a very popular amp. Actually I was not looking at a full pre & power tube amp. Basically something with minimum maintenance after having a few solid states over a period of time hence the hybrid may be a good change. The SV 237 MK 2 is out of my budget & the discounted price for the SV 228 is around 2.10 with taxes.
I had shortlisted O&B(Aniket Das), Marantz 40n(after the price falls) & the Vincent, will wait if something else also comes up. My selection process is very slow after having done some mistakes in the past & don't want to repeat them again

If these fit your criteria can also look up rogue audio sphinx v3 and unison research unico primo both being hybrids.

 

[DB1989]

Vincent 236 mk has very good review by stereophile. https://www.stereophile.com/content/vincent-tubeline-sv-236mk-integrated-amplifier-page-2

These are upgraded versions of the same if m not wrong. But if your speaker sounds bright, may be you have already something which is reflecting the lower treble and upper treble too much in your room. Fitting an acoustic panel at that spot would magically transform the sound. If you have an already treated room, then adding a DSP, would do the magic. But if you need tube distortion sound then this might be the possible way.

No idea, tubes generally have a very soft character (which is a spray of distortion). This effect is unique that it sounds more natural. You should try out at your home to see if it works with your particular speaker.

I think i get where you're coming from - the R800i does sound grainier - now whether thats distortion or new levels of detail can probably be determined by some basic measurements - but it does not sound softer than my solid state Class D and Class A/B amps. Quite the contrary, the treble is sharper and has more attack and impact but it does not sound brighter due to its refinement.

And for reasons i can't explain, notwithstanding DSP/Room EQ with the MiniDSP Flex w/ Dirac Live in a treated room, the R800i just seems to dig up bags of detail i'd never noticed with my earlier DSP'ed solid state amps. It's no exaggeration when I say that I'm listening to my playlists all over again to discover what I'd missed out on earlier. In fact, I'm listening to audiophile BS just cuz it sounds so good with this amp.

But the general statement that tubes have a soft character would hold true for my R8, especially in Triode mode.

If these fit your criteria can also look up rogue audio sphinx v3 and unison research unico primo both being hybrids.

There's something to be said about tube hybrids if one gets it right - I have an el cheapo Aiyima T9 and it sounds bloody brilliant for its bargain basement price

 

[Nitin K]

If these fit your criteria can also look up rogue audio sphinx v3 and unison research unico primo both being hybrids.

Thanks Phew, had considered both especially Unico Primo but wanted tone controls and do not want to add any additional component for eq. Plus HTbypass and subwoofer connection was a prerequisite since I have an avr.

 

[Yelamanchili manohar]

@Nitin K - since you're spending the big bucks and are putting a lot of time and effort into it, why don't you come down to NCR to checkout the amplifier in person. Besides Watthifi, there are quite a few demo rooms with plenty esoteric gear worth checking out. And, you could also come listen to the Wilsenton R800i - its a serious contender if you want Class A and Tubes.

To put things into context through some anecdotal experience - Last night, I had this gentleman over who's had skin in the game for over 30-40 years and runs a pair of Avant Gardes and Zu Soul 6's driven by Nagra Monoblocks, Prima Luna Tube amps, 60kg McIntosh Monoblocks and what not. Suffice to say, he was " blown away" by the sound of the R800i paired with my humble Quad S5s and stated it was the "perfect sound" - i couldn't help sharing this as the smile plastered on my face since last evening simply refuses to fade.

Now, He was an incredibly nice gentleman so I'm not entirely sure whether he was just being kind but we've booked a next date for the R800i with the Avant Gardes

Now it's only a matter of booking a forklift!

P.S. - I exchanged notes with a few more folks who have the R800i and this one dude uses the R800i for to listen to music and a Luxman 509AX-II (currently there's a unit available for 4.6L with a friend if anyone's interested) as his daily driver for general media consumption - needless to say, he prefers the R800i - which is saying something because it was after hearing the very same Luxman model that I decided to go in for the R800i.

If ever there was a post tempting me to buy another tube amp, yours takes the cake for bringing me closest to pulling the trigger . And before I even realize it, Iam already drooling at all the pics of the R800i with their glorious glowing tubes on the net. Off to get a towel now.