Should it be understood, even for a good IA for eg: Cambridge Audio CXA81, which has a ESS Sabre SE9016K2M DAC or the Arcam SA20, which has a ESS 9038K2M Sabre DAC need a desperate DAC ?
Expect such doubts from non-audiophile
Is AV Receiver good for Music ?
- Thread starter Spinekar
- Start date
Should it be understood, even for a good IA for eg: Cambridge Audio CXA81, which has a ESS Sabre SE9016K2M DAC or the Arcam SA20, which has a ESS 9038K2M Sabre DAC need a desperate DAC ?
Expect such doubts from non-audiophile
DAC implementation matters i.e. the sound signature of an external or internal DAC is not dictated solely by the DAC chip used but rather, it is the sum of its parts which, well, includes a number of other partsShould it be understood, even for a good IA for eg: Cambridge Audio CXA81, which has a ESS Sabre SE9016K2M DAC or the Arcam SA20, which has a ESS 9038K2M Sabre DAC need a desperate DAC ?
Expect such doubts from non-audiophile
. I have a Cambridge Audio CXA81 and while the DAC chip is "good enough" when it comes to detail retrieval and what not, i much prefer the sound signature of my Ifi Zen DAC to the one inside the CXA81 when connected to my PC. Is it better than the CXA81? For my ears, yes. Perhaps not objectively though. Is it required? That'll depend on whether you are happy with the sound signature of the internal DAC. If not, some experimentation may be required with external DACs.Also, i prefer my Chord Mojo to the one inside the CXA81 when playing from my streamer.
AVR/AVCs do great in multi-channel Stereo, and they still have more features left. But, stereo only devices will do the best job at being stereo. Choose your poison.
That is what seems to be a big decision making, when you are in likes of both worlds, unfortunately
I have to take time to get audition of both the setup, as much as possible and see which one goes fine with me
Right now, AVR is in consideration but still not signed off IA's
Few IA's are also in mind
spirovious
Well-Known Member
Like other FM said, the way its implemented which matters most. I have assembled diy DAC and when ever l change a part in it say capacitor, its sound signature changes. Some AVR do have Burr-brown chip but if you add external BB chip DAC, the sound will be next level I still remember, l was at FM home some years back who wanted to improve music with Yamaha AVR. Pioneer BDp was the source. Some how music was sounding thinner with wharfedale towers when connected with digital input. When we connected its analog out, sound became fuller and more enjoyable. So that way it goes. Best is to demo in in detail and decide.Should it be understood, even for a good IA for eg: Cambridge Audio CXA81, which has a ESS Sabre SE9016K2M DAC or the Arcam SA20, which has a ESS 9038K2M Sabre DAC need a desperate DAC ?
Expect such doubts from non-audiophile
srinisundar
Well-Known Member
As of today i find the older ESI julia@ ( https://www.esi-audio.com/products/julia/ ) is far better than any other DAC currently in the market for enjoying Stereo..
Passive_audio_enthusiast
Well-Known Member
on paper they are quite similar to modern dacs. If they had done it right back then, it’s still relevant today too
Is there anything, spec wise we should consider while selecting a DAC to connect to an AVR, to improve music ?
I knew we can add an DAC to separates or IA's but first time I hear we can add an DAC to AVR
All AVRs have in built DACs to handle multichannel audio.
An external DAC can be added to any component that has line level analog input.
AVR will usually have one or two line level analog inputs. So you can add a DAC to it.
Specs wise, DACs should be capable of:
- taking in digital on at least one of COAX/USB/OPT inputs
- supporting 44.1/48/96/192 KHz sampling (higher the better is commonly accepted wisdom)
Apart from this it is the DAC chip or topology that determines how it may sound.
Today the common DAC implementation is Delta-Sigma technology.
BurrBrown (TI), AKM chips are supposed to be warm/mellow (easy on the ears).
Sabre chips are supposed to detailed (lots of HF tingle, sometimes frowned up on), though the newer ones sound mellow.
Then there are ladder or R-2R DACs (chip and discrete), special implementations (FPGA, etc).
Exploring DACs is a very deep rabbit hole.
Cheers,
Raghu
What's the difference?
An AVR is also an "amplifier", just like an integrated, albeit with more features such as the ability to take video inputs, drive a larger number of speakers for home theater purposes, receive AM/FM, being a streamer, so on and so forth.
But the reason why an IA is considered better than an AVR of the same price point is because it is more focussed for that purpose i.e. to recreate the best possible stereo effect for the money.
Raghu, to me everything seems to be a very deep rabbit hole
Will adding a DAC to the AVR, increases the sound quality ?
If so, will that difference be felt, if DAC is added to AVR in Pure / Pure Direct Mode or in Stereo mode ?
FMs who have used or using DAC with your AVR for Music can give your experience
Thanks
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Ask your spouse to be the fox. He/she will knock some sense into you.Raghu, to me everything seems to be a very deep rabbit hole
Will adding a DAC to the AVR, increases the sound quality ?
If so, will that difference be felt, if DAC is added to AVR in Pure / Pure Direct Mode or in Stereo mode ?
FMs who have used or using DAC with your AVR for Music can give your experience
Thanks
Jokes apart, start slow. This hobby is maddening. There is always time to address the insanity.
Cheers,
Raghu
amrutmhatre90
Well-Known Member
Yes I have tried this, and it works. Pure Direct or Direct sounds much better but, the inbuilt DAC is sufficient that for a AVR you don't need to invest in external one.
I am now a days enjoying music AVR in late night at low volume, using Spotify or Tidal from HEOs as much as I do on my separates normally.
90% Music listening is on Separates and 10% on AVR.
vinothkumar
Well-Known Member
Unless and until you listen to a good stereo system of the same cost as the AVR that you demoed, you keep asking questions only. Better take a demo or visit FMs places to get real-life experience and get all your questions answered. You are welcome to my home post the 3rd wave
All the best.I am using a Zen DAC with my AVR for a while now. I can't say that there is a huge difference between just the AVR and the AVR with the DAC but I am using it because it does the last unfold of MQA, a format that is again debatable for it's advantages.
I would also say, go slow. If you are going multi channel, get an AVR. If not, get an integrated. For me, ultimately, it's the music more than the equipment. I am at a stage where I can't hear any flaws in my system. No harsh highs, no bloated bass, nice natural mid range and timbre. I hear music from my system and my electronics and my speakers don't distract me from it.
Adding a DAC to your AVR will beget very little gains.Raghu, to me everything seems to be a very deep rabbit hole
Will adding a DAC to the AVR, increases the sound quality ?
If so, will that difference be felt, if DAC is added to AVR in Pure / Pure Direct Mode or in Stereo mode ?
FMs who have used or using DAC with your AVR for Music can give your experience
Thanks
I had a chord mojo and i couldn't realise it's potential till i got myself a competent amp in the Cambridge Audio CXA81. The improvements over the internal DAC were far less evident over the Marantz SR6013.
Similarly, the improvements in the RME ADI 2 DAC FS i got recently are hardly noticeable over the Chord Mojo when connected to the CXA81 (can't say one is better than the other). it'll need a more competent amp.
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Did someone just mention 'Rabbit hole' ?
Well, yesterday I had a opportunity to bring a DAC and 2 channel PA from a friend for the day and listened to music with those in chain. And well, my R3s performance was unleashed, imaging was just amazing. Now I’m a firm believer that for audio to sound really good, a good DAC is important. I’ll start saving up for a good IA with a good inbuilt DAC!
Thanks for your suggestion and inviting too, sure would do, if possible [ post 3rd waveUnless and until you listen to a good stereo system of the same cost as the AVR that you demoed, you keep asking questions only. Better take a demo or visit FMs places to get real-life experience and get all your questions answered. You are welcome to my home post the 3rd wave
]Regards
While audition may not be advisable, considering covid situation, could comparison videos of speakers and IAs in youtube such as E Project
can serve the purpose in understanding the performance of the components at lease to certain level ?
can serve the purpose in understanding the performance of the components at lease to certain level ?
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