JBL 4343 coming soon to Mumbai

[vivek_r]

Part 2; Prem mentioned that the tone can be changed by moving a cm or two. Never to resist the chance to listen and a wet Friday evening, off again to Prem’s.

Attack of the clones; we started off 1.5 cm behind where we sat the other day and Prem said sound had less attack and more tone and I nodded listlessly and did not nod to the music. So Prem started his evening workout by moving back a cm more

Return of the Jedi aka position J: awesomeness! More flow, much better tone and feet and head happy bobbing. But Prem really needed his exercise. Half a cm back again.

The Phantom Menace: a large scale thickening of voices. No baba. Give me the flow. The Premster said let’s go back to where we listened to the other day

The Force Awakens: the sound was again all attack and lost flow and tone. Prem said “perhaps half a cm forward”. Go for it I said, sipping whiskey (hey not complaining)

A New Hope: this was to me the second best position. Did not have all the magic of position J, but was not strident as the previous one. Get back, Jojo. But Prem wasn’t done yet. Wanted to move it marginally ahead of position J

Empire strikes back: very hifi suddenly. A ting here and a tong there. Just missing the magic.

The last Jedi: back to position J and it bloomed. Mister this is it. Listened to Fleetwood Mac and this speaker is meant to rock. So many details.

Rounded off with Asha going “Piya Tu, ab toh aaja”. Very appropriate.

What a fun and educative experience. Kids don’t try it ar home. Certainly I don’t want my butt kicked moving speakers out and about.

 

[prem]

Thanks Vivek. It was a pleasure hosting you and Hari. I did some more fine adjustments today. Wasn’t happy with any of the position we tried yesterday.

Found a new position which I like better than any of the positions we tried. It’s 1.5 cm ahead of the position you and Hari heard the other day. I think this 1.5 cm ahead strikes a good balance between attack and tone. The J position you liked is very sweet sounding but doesn’t give me the attack I am used to when listening in a studio.

 

[prem]

Vivek is right. The J position is where it all falls into place. At other positions it does a few hifi things better but at J position, music plays as a whole and it all comes together. I guess all these years of attending concerts every other week has really fine tuned Vivek’s ears. Respect. Incidentally with my previous Berning amp, both jls001 and audiopro too liked the J position the best

 

[Nikhil]

Looks like J stands for "Jam"

Great writeup Vivek! Always interesting to read your observations.
Still haven't heard the JBLs but someday soon will get a chance.

Regards


.

 

[vivek_r]

Actually I focused a lot on JBL and so do we all given the title and the product being so dominating. What is also relevant is a that it is being driven by a Denon all in one which costs 15000 and a fun listening it was.

And the Denon is of the type still in production (though it may have changed in many ways).

Denon D-M41DAB review

What Hi-Fi? Awards 2023 winner. Bluetooth capability makes this Denon even better than before

www.whathifi.com

So sometimes wonder whether our equipment lust will ever die. Guess not! Hence....

Ending with a quote from Steely Dan (Prem please buy Aja and Gaucho)

“On the counter
By your keys
Was a book of numbers
And your remedies
One of these
Surely will screen out the sorrow
But where are you tomorrow“

 

[prem]

Vivek_r, the Denon DM41 all in one is different from the one I have. The new ones are digital amps. The previous model DM40 and the earlier ones are fine

 

[prem]

Vivek just clarified that the Denon DM 41 has a class AB amp. So i guess it should be fine. I have only heard the early 2000 models and not the new ones but I assume they should all sound the same

 

[vivek_r]

Ok this update, and sorry to use this space for it, has nothing to do with Prem’s system but with the learning.

I am sure many who saw the chat googled for Denon. But how many moved their speakers a little, within the constraints of home/living space, to optimise the sound. I did!

There was one point where the sound locked in and I was moving to the music. Getting solid emotional connect as it were. I even took my usual random room treatment (throwing the cork mats on the floor) steps, but just got so happy with the music.

So please try it. You don’t need golden ears if you are really into music - your feet and body will give you the cues for best spot. Then to impress your audio buddies you can use phrases like “slight warmth over neutralish (which auto correct says is not even a proper word) sound” or “image gets locked in”etc and get your rocks off!

Many thanks Prem for taking the trouble. It is like James Brown screaming “have you seen the light” in that iconic scene in the film, The Blues Brothers

Ps. I am sure there are better spots for the speaker in my room, but this is good enough for now.

 

[mpw]

i get what you are trying to convey and correct speaker placement is necessary ( by trial and error if necessary ) but thats true for all speakers.

Room treatment with a mix of absorbers and diffusers goes a long way too..

But if you sit in front of a large speaker at close distance - many of the above factors are taken out of the equation and one can enjoy music in a better way which is what is happening at prems room i suppose.

I guess many of us have experienced ( enjoyed ) - lock in... and nirvana etc... without being verbal about it..or the need for super large speakers in a medium / large room.

The other factor is Prems excellent source and his top notch vinyl collection - hardly anyone mentions that.

Simply buying something like a JBL 4343 without a great source might not get one anywhere.

The source is half the job done - the little Denon amp is OK grade for conventional speakers but seems to work well with Prems 93 dB speakers ( or maybe any sensitive speakers for that matter ) and then the large speakers, great source and a close listening position.. and there we have it - the ingredients for bliss.

I would love to try a small Naim amp and see the outcomes - just for kicks sake.

As long as one gets the seating position right - i guess your nirvana, and the readers nirvana and mine and Prems will be the same.

Or is there a higher nirvana ??

regards

 

[mpw]

This is a wonderful opportunity to re-visit my last post in this thread.

Not for nothing they say - life is a circle...

The setup is very :-

dynamic - quick response to transients

revealing but not edgy - ears dont bleed

bass - very good - possibly the amp will open up some more - but even at this level an untrained ear will have nothing to complain about
doesnt discriminate between music

One can play Bollywood ( new or old ) and Stevie ray Vaughan or Simon Garfunkel ( what a revelation ) with the same verve - this shows a fantastic source..

The music is well integrated and as a whole - wonderful.

The closest 2nd in Prems setup ( which i have heard ) was the Rethm Saadhana V2 but even that gets surpassed by this by atleast 2-3 country miles ...

Mind you the Saadhana V2 is an amazing speaker in its own right.. ( Hats off )

Lata Mangeshkar on Shraddanjali was awesome !

I look at my post above and must re-iterate all the hard work that is put into the system to make it play at this level.

No pain. No gain - simple.

A small speaker cannot do this magic IMO

Yes - yesterday was nirvana - i had mine and another FM had a great time as well.

Listening to home setups is an eye opening experience and this was no different.

Beautiful..

regards

 

[prem]

Thanks Mahesh for a wonderful summary of the evening. It was great having you and Surrealistix over. We should do this more often

Also last week it was great hosting Nikhil and Souravin. And AVM, the week before. Thank you guys for coming over. Enjoyed the evening with you guys

 

[vivek_r]

It is lovely having friends with different music systems.

When I go to Prem’s with his JBL and EMT turntable, one can really rock out. All amplified music sounds awesome. Speedy Gonsalvez for sure. Air guitar big time!

When I go to TSB’s (a reticent person but as with Prem’s, a fab host to friends), his VPI Classic, PBN phono, and Z-monitor speakers, unamplifed music takes a front seat. We listened to Mahler’s 4 th and was an immersive experience. We listened to the LP through and not “tracks”.

Both are passionate about the hobby and both listen to different kinds of music. And their systems reflects this.

Surrealistix’ music system is also grand. Now if he had a record player....

Me, I get high with a little help from my friends. Happy with mine, but this hobby is a bit of a disease!

 

[Deleted member 15865]

This is a wonderful opportunity to re-visit my last post in this thread.

Not for nothing they say - life is a circle...

The setup is very :-

dynamic - quick response to transients

revealing but not edgy - ears dont bleed

bass - very good - possibly the amp will open up some more - but even at this level an untrained ear will have nothing to complain about
doesnt discriminate between music

One can play Bollywood ( new or old ) and Stevie ray Vaughan or Simon Garfunkel ( what a revelation ) with the same verve - this shows a fantastic source..

The music is well integrated and as a whole - wonderful.

The closest 2nd in Prems setup ( which i have heard ) was the Rethm Saadhana V2 but even that gets surpassed by this by atleast 2-3 country miles ...

Mind you the Saadhana V2 is an amazing speaker in its own right.. ( Hats off )

Lata Mangeshkar on Shraddanjali was awesome !

I look at my post above and must re-iterate all the hard work that is put into the system to make it play at this level.

No pain. No gain - simple.

A small speaker cannot do this magic IMO

Yes - yesterday was nirvana - i had mine and another FM had a great time as well.

Listening to home setups is an eye opening experience and this was no different.

Beautiful..

regards

Thanks @mpw. Missed the evening and meeting you all. Since you heard Prem’s rig with the Denon earlier and now with the Quicksilver, could you contrast the two sounds more specifically? Like for example, what change to the sound signature did you notice with the added tube interface? With the new amp was the sound more refined/clearer than before? Especially when listening to fusion/hard rock? How well did you feel the QS matched with the JBLs in terms of power and sound? Of course Prem’s LP collection is stuff of legends and makes the biggest difference to the listening pleasure at his place, but I want to understand how the QS specifically contributes. Can you please elaborate on your experience further?

 

[mpw]

Thanks @mpw. Missed the evening and meeting you all. Since you heard Prem’s rig with the Denon earlier and now with the Quicksilver, could you contrast the two sounds more specifically? Like for example, what change to the sound signature did you notice with the added tube interface? With the new amp was the sound more refined/clearer than before? Especially when listening to fusion/hard rock? How well did you feel the QS matched with the JBLs in terms of power and sound? Of course Prem’s LP collection is stuff of legends and makes the biggest difference to the listening pleasure at his place, but I want to understand how the QS specifically contributes. Can you elaborate on your experience further?

Hi

I haven't heard with the Denon so i cant comment.

I also poor at analyzing music and describing it too but i guess i rely on spidey sense to discern.

But i am a sucker for good music and would have fallen for that as well i suppose..

thanks

 

[prem]

Quicksilver and Denon are different sounding. Quicksilver is way more layered, with much better separation, and much more texture. Tonal density is also way way higher. It’s more refined and will appeal to most music lovers. Quicksilver, one can say, is a bonafide mid level amp.

Denon is entry level and is better to have a rocking night out. What you heard with the Denon was also not optimal because the Denon was just placed on the ground. I had not used any isolation for it. With the Quicksilver I have taken care of that

 

[Deleted member 15865]

Hi

I haven't heard with the Denon so i cant comment.

I also poor at analyzing music and describing it too but i guess i rely on spidey sense to discern.

But i am a sucker for good music and would have fallen for that as well i suppose..

thanks

Oh, I am sorry. Your previous post dated 10 Nov in this thread led me to assume that.

Quicksilver and Denon are different sounding. Quicksilver is way more layered, with much better separation, and much more texture. Tonal density is also way way higher. It’s more refined and will appeal to most music lovers. Quicksilver, one can say, is a bonafide mid level amp.

Denon is entry level and is better to have a rocking night out. What you heard with the Denon was also not optimal because the Denon was just placed on the ground. I had not used any isolation for it. With the Quicksilver I have taken care of that

Thanks Prem. Texture added to the dynamics of the JBL - that’d be something!

 

[audiopro]

Lets not forget this is a 1970s design. Just goes to show how much we have advanced in 40 years and how marketing has taken over good product design over time. So is the turntable and phono stage. (added after Prem objected to them feeing depressed for being left out)

 

[prem]

So is the turntable

 

[mpw]

So what's the recommended detox after listening to a setup like Prems ?

Some depressant - alcohol )
Some more music - At your own home
Some music shopping therapy
Some hardware changing therapy
Counting coins in the piggy bank
Brighten up and ask Prem when is he planning the next change ..maybe we can snag something ?
Vipassana
Any other

Take your pick and let us know..

 

[prem]

Mpw, you missed out on the easiest one. Shift bed and baggage to Prem’s house