Roadmap of my setup : need inputs and recommendation from the pro's

[netant]

Hello all after going through the forum, i have gathered a basic knowledge and now need your recommendation and guidance in building my first setup.

1 : The OVERVIEW

Requirements:- A 5.1 setup to be used for 80% music and 20% movies.
Budget:- INR 100,000/- (+/-)
Media Details:- The playback requirements for Audio and Video are as follows. Source of playing optical disc and TV are already exists hence will not be discussed here.

Genres of music:- Rock, Metal, Alternatives, Fusion, Country, Trance, Indian semi / classical /sufi and rarely Bollywood music.

Source of Music:-

• Audio CD/DVD
• FLAC
• WAV /DTS

Source of Movies:-

• DVD/ BD
• MKV /WMV /MP4 (1080p /5.1 dts audio)

​

apart form Audi CD/ DVD/BD other files will be streamed (wireless) from Computer or using Media Player to feed the AVR.​

Estimated Date of setup Up & Running:- not later then June 2012.
​

2 : The Requirements:

1. The AVR - Discussion Open
2. Speakers - Discussion Closed
3. Cables & Accessories - Discussion Closed
4. Media player - Discussion Closed

3 : Equipment under consideration:

1. The AVR
   • Denon AVR-1312 - INR 23,900/-
   • Denon AVR-1612 - INR 29,900/-
   • Denon AVR-1912 - INR 45,900/-
   
   
2. Speakers
   • Option-1 : Pioneer
     • Pioneer SP-PK51FS - INR 43,000/-
       Link - Details
   • Option-2 : Cambridge Audio : Sirocco (S series) - Estimated Price:- INR 43,000/-
     • Left/ Right:-S70 floorstander
     • Center:-S50 centre
     • Sub:-S90 subwoofer
     • Rear(L/R):-S30 bookshelf
       link - details .
   • Option-3 : Polk Audio - ~ INR 64,000/-
     • Left/ Right:-TSi 400 - INR 29,000/- pair
     • Center:-CS 10 - INR 9,500/-
     • Sub:-PSW 110 - 13,000/-
     • Rear(L/R):-TSi100 - INR 11,000/- Pair
   • Option-4 : Coming soon - awaiting discussion & your suggestion
     • Left/ Right:-?
     • Center:-?
     • Sub:-?
     • Rear:- ?
   
   
3. Cables & Accessories - As required.
   
   
4. Media player
   • HIMEDIA HD600C Full HD Networked Media Player
   • Some WD box
   • ?
     

4 : The Discussion

1. AVR​

After comparing head to head the AVR in the site (Product Comparision | DENON US)
i didn't get a clear picture which one to go for ?
1312 - is not meant for HD audio, i somewhere got in this forum, hence discarding.
I dont need 7.1 audio, can any one suggest which one to pick, 1612 or 1912 ?​

Thanks.

 

[pupupuchi28]

2 : The Requirements:

1. The AVR - Discussion Open
2. Speakers - Discussion Closed
3. Cables & Accessories - Discussion Closed
4. Media player - Discussion Closed

[*]Speakers
[*] Option-4 : Coming soon - awaiting discussion & your suggestion

• Left/ Right:-?
• Center:-?
• Sub:-?
• Rear:- ?

[/LIST]

Do you mean you need a suggestion or not?

Also consider wharfedale package (9.5 or 10.5 series), a tad above your budget.

 

[denom]

Pay attention to the packages on offer in group buys.

Your pref is more towards music, so consider the marantz/wharfedale package @ 99999/-

 

[kaushik]

I guess you have a proper room for such an activity.
so the expenditure for room etc also comes ,else 5.1 setup is not fully realized

some of my observations :
- AVRs dont do that good job for music , they may be feature rich
- Rock like music need special punch and powerful amp or needs a special Sub
may be half of the budget will go here
- If you want new features Android media player will be better

Good movie experience (money game ..)->
projector + screen + room treatment + cables + seats + dedicated room + well ripped HD media + dedicated player

 

[netant]

Do you mean you need a suggestion or not?
Also consider wharfedale package (9.5 or 10.5 series), a tad above your budget.

Yes i need suggestion
i will update some more option shortly, im reading more about speaker now. Wharfedale & jamo im avoiding on friends recommendation.

Pay attention to the packages on offer in group buys. Your pref is more towards music, so consider the marantz/wharfedale package @ 99999/-

Thanks for the suggestion but I would like stick with Denon (Call me a fanboy ).

I guess you have a proper room for such an activity.
so the expenditure for room etc also comes, else 5.1 setup is not fully realized

some of my observations :
- AVRs dont do that good job for music, they may be feature rich
- Rock like music need special punch and powerful amp or needs a special Sub
may be half of the budget will go here
- If you want new features Android media player will be better

Good movie experience (money game ..)->
projector + screen + room treatment + cables + seats + dedicated room + well ripped HD media + dedicated player

Thanks Kaushik, yes room is not an issue and room acoustics iteration is in my mind.
Amp, may be not right now, but can you suggest some good subs. It not mandaory fro me to build 5.1 right away, i can go for 2 full range speakers with a sub, later on add center & surrounds.

i would like to hear more from Denon owners, i want to fix the avr before jumping into speaker discussion, which i think is the most important factor deciding the output.
good movie experience not required, i hardly watch 2 movies in a month & i prefer theater instead in home

 

[murali]

80% music and 20% movies? With 5.1 setup and AVR base for < Rs1L?
It is a pipedream.
80% movies and 20% music, it may be a reality. Or, if the music is going to serve only as a background when you pay more attention to doing something else.

Good luck.
murali

 

[netant]

80% music and 20% movies? With 5.1 setup and AVR base for < Rs1L?
It is a pipedream.
80% movies and 20% music, it may be a reality. Or, if the music is going to serve only as a background when you pay more attention to doing something else.

Good luck.
murali

pipedream heh i understadnd your emotions murali
The fact is, neither i have inherited property nor my parents belong to politics :sad: Else i could have gone for MRX-700 with best Bowers & wilkins speakers.

i dont want the best possible in this universe but, the best possible in that budget.

 

[canchi]

For music you need good floorstanders and as somebody has suggested, an amp.But if you want to stick to a Denon receiver, then go for the Denon 1912 and use the stereo mode or pure direct. I abhor music coming from 5.1 speakers! 5.1 is good only for movies.

I have a Denon 1911 and the paradigm monitor 9s as floorstanders. Great speakers,good for classical, semi classical and sufi music that I am pretty fond of. The monitor 11s are out for sometime now and sound good. You've got to audition the speakers first with the music of your choice and then decide.

 

[netant]

For music you need good floorstanders and as somebody has suggested, an amp.But if you want to stick to a Denon receiver, then go for the Denon 1912 and use the stereo mode or pure direct. I abhor music coming from 5.1 speakers! 5.1 is good only for movies.

I have a Denon 1911 and the paradigm monitor 9s as floorstanders. Great speakers,good for classical, semi classical and sufi music that I am pretty fond of. The monitor 11s are out for sometime now and sound good. You've got to audition the speakers first with the music of your choice and then decide.

Thanks Mate. amp i'm not considering now.

I'm not getting expected reviews about denon avr, from Denons website comparison, all models seems similar to me except 1912 has airplay (which is useless for me) & 15 Watts Per Channel more then other. does that 15 watt worth 15K extra ?
Denon 1312 wont be able to decode my FLAC hence that's cancelled.

 

[murali]

pipedream heh i understadnd your emotions murali
The fact is, neither i have inherited property nor my parents belong to politics :sad: Else i could have gone for MRX-700 with best Bowers & wilkins speakers.

i dont want the best possible in this universe but, the best possible in that budget.

None of us, at least most of us, has inherited property or parents belong to politics. At least in my case, I can say it is all money earned myself legally and without cheating anyone..
But that is not the point. One lakh rupees is a big amount and if you are seeking 80% music, why do you want a 5.1 HT setup? You need a plan and patience to invest and that takes time and efforts. If you spend that money in a pair of good speakers, a source and an integrated amplifier, you can enjoy music (80%) and also decent movie audio. Wait for some more time to procure other paraphernilia needed to build HT experience. That is what many of us did and still do.
It is your money and I intervened only because I don't want you to spend such a big amount and get nowhere. But you know the best and if you feel confident and right, please go ahead.

cheers and bye.
murali

 

[netant]

...One lakh rupees is a big amount and if you are seeking 80% music, why do you want a 5.1 HT setup? You need a plan and patience to invest and that takes time and efforts. If you spend that money in a pair of good speakers, a source and an integrated amplifier, you can enjoy music (80%) and also decent movie audio.

you are absolutely right.
Speakers are what im giving more priority.
but my knowledge is bit restrictive at this point.
anyways , im considering paradigm monitor-7, INR42K / pair or monitor-9 (price not known) with a decent sub.
what you say ?

 

[canchi]

Meet up with Lokesh at HT Store.Audition the speakers first. He will give you a good deal on the Monitor 9s, if you wish

 

[anm]

As Murali said - if you want 80% music, spend most of your money on stereo setup.
I enjoyed watching movies from my stereo amp + fs quite a lot. Buy the best FS with best stereo amp that you can afford at current budget. Best sounding to you. See if you really hate watching movies on it. Will it do for those 20% times?

Movie setup is an entirely different game and needs much more money. You would want surround speakers, subwoofers, large TV or projector, screen, universal remote, popcorn machine etc.

 

[milestoneseeker]

Repeating what others have already stressed on the thread:

Don't aim for 5.1 considering your requirement is primarily music. Just like canchi, I too have Monitor 9 (series 7) driven by 1911. Only difference, I stopped at this set-up as I had spent close to 85k Buy a good (not a decent) pair of FS and do them justice by buying an AVR (as movies still need to be viewed!) with enough juice. 1612 will fall short on that front. Even if you want to buy the Monitor 7, do buy the 1912. See if you can dig up the 1911 lying around somewhere as airplay is not of interest to you (was same with me). I bought a discounted 1911 for 32k when 1912 came to market

Try squeezing in a SW for a better movies experience and I am sure you won't miss 5.1 for a while. 2.1 would do very nicely to begin with.

And yes, AVR may not do justice to music when compared to int amps, a good AVR certainly doesn't screw up the experience! So don't be biased against AVRs' capabilities.

You may also try out the Monitor Audio's Bronze series for a pair of FS.

 

[afj]

i second murali. if youre mostly going to use it for music go for a simple stereo setup. you will get much better sq

 

[Flash]

I am going to go the other way on this .
If you want flexibility with multitude of connectivity options AVR no doubt about it .
Contrary to belief a AVR is not that bad for music.
get synergy right of the amp + speakers+ cables correct and you will have a nice HT / Stereo setup .

Although your movies take up 20% of your listening habits with a 2 channels stereo setup you will always find something missing in movies.
Movies is all about the surround sound experience .
The center / surrounds and Sub play a very vital part. without these components, the whole movie / gaming experience goes for a toss.

Buy speakers first . then audition amps
Buy a AVR which has preouts so that you can add a Stereo integrated later to the chain if you feel the need or if budget permits
A stereo Amp get one with HT bypass or similar

Phase your setup purchase step by step. you don't need to buy everything at one shot. phase it out get yourself the front channels and AVR first. add the center surrounds sub later.
After a couple of months when there is more cash flow add a good CDP and Integrated.

You mentioned that you have ruled out Wharf / Jamo's based on some freinds recommendations. Don't make that mistake
Audition them again . the Wharf 9.5 is a really good speaker at the price point and you will not regret the choice.

Folks over here may think that I am taking through my ASS about AVR first and stereo later. However I am talking through personal experience. I have a AVR as well as stereo setup and everything was bought in phases and still not complete.
75% of the FMs here have a proper AVR setup and have added stereo amps later into the chain to get the extra oomph for stereo.

Here's a look at my current setup I have a AVR which i bought first a couple of years ago and changed my speakers in 2011. I added a stereo Amp, Power amps, etc in phases. I have a good sub now and I still don't have a center. I do have surrounds in place. I still have components missing. I sold off my aging Teac CDP and other components recently.
Components missing CDP, Center channel, HTPC, TT, DAC, Preamp. will be adding all this over the next 2 quarters
Components pictured here Rotel poweramps, Arcam Integrated acting as a preamp temp, Denon AVR, Samsung BDP, samsung 51" TV, Xbox360, Videocon DVD, Sony media center, JC mathews Media player, Wharf 9.6 (selling it soon), B&W 685 Subs not in picture

 

[netant]

Thanks you for all your nice and very informative comments.

paradigm monitor-9, the specs says:- 4-driver, 2-1/2-way bass reflex, quasi-3rd-order resistive port, ....
i don't get the real meaning of 2-1/2-way bass reflex, are they better the 3-way bass reflex.
As somewhere i read full range speaker should have 3-way bass reflex, don't know how far that stands true.

Pre-out is not available in 1912, it only available in higher models 3XXX.

 

[murali]

My observations on Flash's setup:

Shift your TV to the middle of the enclosed space and a little higher; put both your speakers inside that space and to the maximum possible distance from the rear wall; move your A/V rack away from that space, surely out of that space. May be, you need to run longer speaker cables through the floor or roof.

With only the TV (at the back) and both speakers (front) in that enclosed space, symmetrical, believe me, you will hear something completely different from your system.

Just a suggestion, if it helps.

cheers.
murali

 

[Flash]

My observations on Flash's setup:

Shift your TV to the middle of the enclosed space and a little higher; put both your speakers inside that space and to the maximum possible distance from the rear wall; move your A/V rack away from that space, surely out of that space. May be, you need to run longer speaker cables through the floor or roof.

With only the TV (at the back) and both speakers (front) in that enclosed space, symmetrical, believe me, you will hear something completely different from your system.

Just a suggestion, if it helps.

cheers.
murali

Hey thanks Murali .... Well my initial plan was on doing that.... However this is the problem i face... I sit approx 20-22 feet away ... the wall width is hardly 7 feet., that gives me a distance of approx 6 feet speaker to speaker...
At the distance where I sit.. I don't get a center image and my entire stereo experience goes for a toss. After playing around for a good 2 months. I found that I get the best depth / Soundstage and center image with the speakers placed 10 feet apart. and me pulling up my listening position closer by around 2 feet. Ideally i should have been not more than 15 feet away but cant help it

this is literally after months of playing around with different speaker positions that I foound the sweet spot for my stereo
Rear wal distance is around 2-2.5 feet. So rear wall is not a problem . Side wall reflections is the problem. I have not found a major decremented effect so far.

I did find some slight reflection problems where I sit. So Carpeted a 12x10 area. put heavy curtains behind me and add the pot with flowers on the center table...hyeah:hyeah:hyeah:
Ok the flowers if bullshit .. thats my wife's work ...

As of Now when i sit on my Couch the middle of my TV is at exact eye level. Yes I should place it a couple of inches higher. Let me try that

 

[netant]

Meet up with Lokesh at HT Store.Audition the speakers first. He will give you a good deal on the Monitor 9s, if you wish

called him up whil shortly visit him as the monitor 9 is not in stock